#209: Janet Verney - Getting to the Root Cause of a Mystery Illness
Rip welcomes author and health coach, Janet Verney, to the PLANTSTRONG Podcast.
For 40 years, Janet suffered from an undiagnosed illness that affected her lungs and gut, leading to years of medical treatments, antibiotics, and even a cumbersome breathing machine.
In 2013, she started focusing on optimizing her health through lifestyle changes and a whole foods, plant-based diet and it was only then that her real healing began. As she says in the episode, she now has control over her illness. It no longer controls her. Today, she is affectionately referred to as the "plant-based princess of positivity" by friends and clients.
As a coach, she helps others "unearth" their dis-ease to get to the root cause of their issues. How?
* She helps you "weed" out the excuses and roadblocks
* She teaches you to "nourish" your body with nutrition, self-care, and doing the things you love
* If you weed and nourish, you will "bloom" into the person you were always meant to be
Her books Roots2Wellness and her new cookbook Health'd Up are available at https://janetverney.com/
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Full Transcript via AI Transcription
[0:01] I'm Rip Esselstyn and welcome to the Plant Strong Podcast. The mission at Plant Strong is to further the advancement of all things within the plant-based movement.
We advocate for the scientifically proven benefits of plant-based living and envision a world that universally understands, promotes, and prescribes plants as a solution to empowering your health, enhancing your performance, restoring the environment, and becoming better guardians to the animals we share this planet with.
We welcome you wherever you are on your Plan Strong journey, and I hope that you enjoy the show.
[0:41] If you don't change your lifestyle, your lifestyle may change you.
It's a powerful statement from today's guest, author and health coach, Janet Verney.
For 40 years, Janet suffered from a painful and undiagnosed illness that ran throughout her lungs and gut.
Decades of breathing machines and antibiotics left her vulnerable to all sorts of illness, and it wasn't until just 10 years ago that she explored an anti-inflammatory whole food, plant-based diet that she truly began her healing.
Today, through her books and classes, she helps others unearth the root cause of their disease and she teaches people how to weed out their roadblocks, nourish their body and soul with all the good stuff so that they become the full bloom of who they were meant to be.
It's her path from roots to wellness, and here to talk about it is Janet Verney.
[1:42] Janet Verney, what is going on? Welcome to the Plant Strong Podcast.
Oh, thank you so much, Rip. I'm excited to be here.
I have been following your work and I love your family.
And it's just been such a wonderful addition to my life.
Well, I want to talk all about that, how it's been a wonderful addition to your life.
If I'm not mistaken, you So are you in the Hartford, Connecticut area?
Is that where you live?
I live in Higginham, the same town as your brother and his wife, Anne, and they've actually been to my home for dinner.
I made my first all plant-based meal for company, which was a blast.
So it was a lot of fun.
Wow, I did not know you were from Higginham. What a cute little town.
Yeah, it's adorable.
And do you ever go out for pizza at the pizza place that's down the hill?
Yeah, Da Vinci's, they actually make a really nice gluten-free and I ask them to hold the cheese and load it up on veggies and it makes me very happy.
Nice, well, we like that. I've certainly eaten there a couple of times when I've been visiting Ted.
So Janet, I'm trying to think where I want to start with you.
Transitioning from Corporate Job to Pursuing Passion
[3:07] You've done a lot in the last couple of years. How about if we start with this?
So I know that you kind of started your journey in about 2016, I could be wrong, but 2016 is when I think you were in kind of the.
[3:25] The rat race, so to speak, you know, working, doing your corporate job, and at some point you just said, this is enough.
I need to get out of this. What were you doing that you decided you were going to move on?
Well, I actually was in the biotech world and I was helping these serial entrepreneurs.
[3:44] Start up biotech companies. And then sometimes we would flip them to larger companies.
So it was a lot of hours, a lot of stress. Love the people I worked with, but the work itself wasn't a good fit for me.
And I've had a passion because of my own illness for nutrition and wellness.
And I just wanted to focus on that.
So that's how I ended up doing that.
Well, so what, when you say, you know, you had some illness, What kind of illness did you have?
So I'm still undiagnosed, Rip. It's really an oddity. My doctors call me a mystery.
I've been in all kinds of studies at Yale. I was in a study at the National Institutes of Health's Undiagnosed Disease Program. It's quite a mouthful.
[4:38] And it's lung and gut, which is very classic of cystic fibrosis.
And while I was there, we ruled that out, although they believe that it's a gene in the same pathway as cystic fibrosis.
So back in 2013, I was really sick.
I was on respiratory machines, a respiratory vest, nebulized medications, lots of medications, and had trouble breathing.
And so I set out on a journey to do whatever I could to optimize my health because I couldn't get a diagnosis and the medications they would put me on just kept making me sick.
Wow. How long did that go on?
[5:26] I have had it for 40 years. I've had this condition for 40 years, but it was 2013, when I really started turning the corner. I was able to get off all of my machines. I'm off all prescription medications now, and it's really been through lifestyle and diet. The condition is still there, but I'm in charge of it now. I am controlling it.
So when it does present itself, how does it manifest itself in you these days? Is it respiratory?
Yeah, respiratory. So if I'm near people that have got a cold or bronchitis or any kind of virus or illness, it tends to go to my lungs. So they get infected and then I'd have to go on an antibiotic. But my infections, because of the way I'm supporting my immune system through food, diet, lifestyle, and supplements, I have been able to prevent infections.
Very rarely do I need to get on an antibiotic now. It's been a while and it's been incredible.
Wow, because yeah, because we all know how, um...
If this is the right word, how damaging antibiotics can be to our gut health. Oh, yeah.
Countless rounds of antibiotics and gut healing journey
[6:51] How many, how many over the course of your lifetime, how many rounds of antibiotics would you say you have been on? Oh, my goodness, Rip. I can't, too many to count. I literally was on on antibiotics one week a month.
So, I mean, that's at least 12 times in a year.
You know, that was standard for me. Do not say that out loud to Robin Shetcan or Dr. B, William, Dr. Bolshevitz.
Wow.
So I've had a lot of gut healing to do through the years and that's what ended up, I focused on lung and gut health, and as Hippocrates once said, all disease begins in the gut.
And I truly believe that that's been the foundation of helping me to heal is focusing on my gut health.
How do you think that Hippocrates back in the day was that brilliant and knew that all disease begins in the gut?
[7:56] That's a really good question. I don't know, I wish I met the man because I quote him all the time, but he definitely was ahead of his time and knew what he was talking about.
And I so wish that people had listened to him back then, because I think we'd have a healthier community out there.
Well, he is, yeah, he's got a lot of great quotes, doesn't he?
But because of that, and because of your condition, and it sounds like, you know, all these different rounds of antibiotics you've been on, that you have become a, gut guru of sorts. And, and, you know, let me take a step back here, because you have written several books. You're I think you've written Rainbow Bird, Roots to Wellness. And then most recently, you have this, this great book, Health Up, where you actually go into great detail on gut health, and all the different dysbiosis that is occurring in our culture right now, because I think most of us are getting just a paltry amount of fiber into our diets these days.
[9:15] Do you want to talk about some of the conditions that are going on right now because of us not getting an adequate amount of fiber?
Various conditions arising from inadequate fiber intake
[9:26] Oh, absolutely. So I will say SIBO, small intestinal bacterial overgrowth, is a big issue for a lot of people. Leaky gut is an issue. We've got IBS, which is irritable bowel syndrome.
That's when they don't really know what the heck you have. You just are uncomfortable and you're either not pooping well, or you're pooping too much, or the gamut of issues.
People have GERD and heartburn and reflux.
Oh my gosh, I could go on and on with the various different things.
No, you do. You have a list of about 18 different things in the book.
Do you, let's just, do you experience any of those things today?
Very occasionally, I will get an IBS type flare up of just discomfort, but it's far and few between and I tend to know my triggers.
So I'm very careful, but I'm really, I have really moved away from processed foods and really focused on whole plant-based foods.
Consistency in Healthy Eating for Decades
[10:36] Yeah, it's it's incredible to me because you know, I've been I've been on this journey for about 35 years now since about 1987 that I started eating this way. And I can literally like almost count on my two hands the number of times that I've had, like, you know, got issues. I mean, diarrhea, constipation, constipation, those things. And it's just a completely it's a testament to being just consistently on this path for literally almost, you know, going into my fourth decade now.
Yeah. Wow. You're way ahead of me.
[11:13] We all got to start somewhere. Exactly. No, I'll tell you, it's, you know, we have a, and I forget who actually said this, but we have a healthcare system that doesn't care about our food and we've got a food industry that doesn't care about our health. And so what I've learned through the years, um, and especially from your family, who I adore, is that getting rid of the processed food and focusing on whole foods, getting rid of extracted oils, is what's going to nurture your body inside and out. I see people with skin issues and I think, oh, what's going on in the gut? Too too many processed foods, you know, or too much oil or too much, you know, fried foods.
And, you know, so I immediately go to what's happening in the gut.
Yeah.
[12:10] You, I can't remember where I saw it. Maybe it was in one of your books or on your website, but you kind of, your philosophy is something called like collective medicine.
Can you explain what collective medicine is in your eyes? Yeah, absolutely.
So I love the fact that we can bridge Western medicine medicine with like Eastern medicine or different modalities. There's energy healing, there's acupuncture, there's all different types. There's the foods on your fork, which the things that you're putting in your mouth, but there's also what the Institute of Integrative Nutrition calls primary foods, which is your spirituality, your relationships, the work that you do. It's the lifestyle that that you're leading and managing those stressors in your life.
So in my opinion, you take the best of everything.
Like the, you know, I've learned so much from so many different doctors in my life, holistic practitioners, NDs, you name it. And I take the best or what works well for me.
And it's kind of collective. I feel like I've taken it all and put it in my nice little jar and it just really makes me thrive.
Nice, I like that a lot.
[13:39] So in one of your books, Roots to Wellness, you talk about how you believe in like four things.
Unearthing the Root Cause of Imbalances in the Body
[13:51] Unearthing, weeding, nourishing, and blooming. Can you talk about those things?
Absolutely. So unearth is getting to the root, getting to the root of the problem.
And it could be very much in the primary foods as far as like, you know, a job that isn't serving you, your stress levels are high. So you want to unearth what's at the root cause of what's causing you agita in your body. What is causing that imbalance? It could be a gluten intolerance.
It could be a number of different things, but we want to unearth what's at the root of it.
Unearthing the Root Causes of Distress
[14:34] Any tricks for us to understand how best to unearth what might be causing some distress in our lives?
Cause maybe it's not obvious.
Or maybe, what do you recommend?
Well, I think a couple of things. I think there are some wonderful integrative health coaches out there.
So I'm going to give a plug for them because often they will ask you the tough questions.
They're going to dig and dig and dig until you unearth what is at the root.
I know for me, I grew up in a really abusive household and I think a big part of the dis-ease that I carried in my body had to do with a very turbulent childhood and working through letting go of that, even at the tissue level of the body, moving that negative energy out, focusing on shifting your positivity in every aspect of your life.
And so those things were really important for me in the process of unearthing.
[15:41] So you meant, so I grew up in an abusive household. So have you always been positive or is that something that you had to somehow bring into your life and into your personality?
I had to bring it into my life, you know.
I think I've always been, as my therapist many moons ago, when I was working through all of this, used to say to me that I was a child of resilience. My father would beat us till we cried, and I would refuse to cry. I was a very stubborn little girl.
[16:20] Can I ask you this? Because when you say beat you until you cry, are we talking like actually striking you?
Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. With a belt, a whip. It was like a thin belt that was like a whip.
Sometimes it was grabbing me by the hair and throwing my head into a door. Sometimes it was just a hand across the face. A lot of this I don't even remember. I've got older siblings, a sister who's 10 years older, who actually helped me work through some of it and recall some of it, but yeah, working through that.
And I used to be, I think with my illness as well, I was in a chronic victim mode.
So when you're in a chronic victim mode and you live in a state of fear, it further erodes your health.
And that was something I had to really work on. So one of the things I did is I kept a little journal on one side of the journal, every time a negative thought popped into my head, I would rephrase it into something positive in the right column.
And then eventually, as I did this over a period of time, I cut it in half, I burned up the negative side, I kept my positive side.
And believe it or not, those positive things I rewrote into a love letter to myself.
[17:49] It's actually in my Roots to Wellness book. And I wrote myself this love letter. I read
Shifting from Fear to Belief and Removing Doubt
[17:55] that letter before I went to bed every single night for probably a good year. And all of those things have literally come to be in that love letter. So it really made such a difference in in my health, when we shift from fear, and often we shift into what a lot of people refer to as hope, and then a mentor in my life said we need to remove the word hope from our vocabulary.
And I thought, what are you talking about? I live on hope.
And he said, no, let's replace that with believe.
When we believe that we can get better, when we believe in ourselves and in our life and we get rid of the word hope, hope leaves room for doubt and you don't wanna leave that room for doubt.
You wanna believe that what you want to accomplish is doable, that you can do this.
So that was part of the shifting for me.
[18:56] I like all that. You know, you mentioned when you have a negative thought, you write on the opposite side of the page, a positive thought.
I have heard that we as humans typically have somewhere in the neighborhood of six to eight thousand, At a minimum thoughts a day and like 85% of those are usually typically negative. Yes, Absolutely. Oh wait.
[19:23] No, I was gonna say so like huge congratulations on you on putting in putting in the time and the effort to you know So.
Beat that, right? And believe that you could do it. That's huge.
Yeah. We can look at our past and we can learn from it, but if we carry it around as baggage on our backpack, like a backpack, we're never going to be well. We're never going to be happy.
We're never going to feel joy. So you got to lose it. You got to find a way to shed that that backpack and move forward.
And so that was my goal. And my girlfriend actually gave me a nickname.
She calls me the plant-based princess of positivity.
[20:13] That's good. That's really good. So that's, so we've just touched on earth.
The next one is weed.
If you're done.
Yeah, we actually touched base a little bit on that. So weed is all about weeding out the obstacles.
What is standing in your way?
You got to ditch the excuses. So I get people that they want to lose weight or they want to improve their health in some way, but they'll put up these roadblocks.
And what I say is, let's start breaking those down.
They say, oh, I couldn't do that. I couldn't give this up or I can't change that.
And I'll say, well, let's break it down.
So we break it down into small pieces and we look at, you know, what are some of the changes that you can make? What are some- Can we role play for a second? Sure.
Okay, so let's say that I am coming to you and I'm like, Janet, I just, I can't give up my stakes.
I just love my stakes too much. They, it's who I identify as.
I love my barbecuing on the weekends and just don't take that away from me.
[21:29] Okay, well, usually what I do is I have a philosophy that we're going to crowd in.
Rather than crowding out the bad foods, we're gonna start to crowd in the good foods.
So what I do is I start encouraging them to add more plant-based proteins into their diet.
[21:48] You know, we might even talk about, you know, making a really hearty lentil burger, or we might do a portobello steak, or I'll do a cauliflower roast with all the fixins around it and this wonderful kind of a maple mustard glaze on top.
And we'll start to crowd in some things that they might enjoy.
And if barbecue sauce is their thing, then we're going to find things that work for them with the barbecue sauce. And then I'm going to challenge them.
To give up that steak for just one weekend. Give me a weekend and let's play.
And usually they'll do that. And then they'll say, you know what? That wasn't so bad.
And in fact, the night that I had your brother and Ann over for dinner, we had another couple that they're really good friends with who are both meat eaters, one of which is very much a meat eater.
And after this plant-based dinner that I served, he said to me, he goes, You know, if somebody cooked like that for me, I would not miss meat at all.
So I had made a shepherd's pie and I had done all kinds of other goodies.
And he was just like, this is amazing. So it's a matter of crowding it in.
We got to crowd it in.
I like that. I like that a lot. You didn't happen to make for dessert your pesto chocolate bark, did you?
[23:13] No, I made my chocolate cake, which has a good dose of butter beans in the frosting. And- Wow. Yeah.
Well, yeah. So for people that don't know what we're kind of talking about here, you've got a recipe section in your Health Up book.
And you've got a sweet section that is literally probably to live for, not to die for, to live for.
And in there, you've got that chocolate cake you're talking about and lemon cookies and this, this pesto chocolate bark.
Can't believe I've never heard of such a thing.
Well, it's cute because we have a good friend who does this pesto mania every year.
Everything that comes to the party has got some kind of basil or pesto or herbal, you know, thing in it.
And I decided that for sweets, I would make the pesto bark with the holy basil, just the little tiny leaves and the dried cranberries and some pine nuts and with a nice dark, you know, plant-based chocolate that, and it's just, it's a wonderful combination.
It's just really yummy.
Nourishing the Body Inside and Out
[24:30] Okay, are we done with weed? You wanna go on to nourish? Sure, okay.
So nourish is exactly what it is. It's nourishing your body inside and out, and nourishment is, of course, the food on your forks, which is one of my passions.
And when I think of nourishing, I think of putting in, of course, whole food, plant-based foods that are full of antioxidants, polyphenols, all the good stuff that just your body's going to thrive on.
And greens are so important. I love getting my greens in. I try and sneak them in at every meal.
It's interesting, it's interesting because.
[25:13] Under greens, I read in your book that you recommend that people that have thyroid issues, make sure that they cook their greens and not to have them raw.
Can you explain that a little bit?
Yeah, well, you know, that's one of my friends who is also an integrative health coach.
She is a thyroid expert, like that is her thing. And this is something she speaks to.
And I don't know the full, you know, biochemistry behind it, But it's one of her highest recommendations for people with thyroid issues is not eating too much raw kale, spinach, things like that.
And cooking them, I guess, helps reduce a certain compound that could contribute to, I guess, like a goiter or things that could disrupt the thyroid or the endocrine system.
So that is one of the little tidbits that I picked up.
[26:11] Well, it's interesting you mentioned that because I remember reading somewhere, it might have been the New York Times, where these people were having these competitions to see who could put the most spinach into their smoothies.
And as a result, I think it was mostly women were kind of getting these goiters, right?
Was something related to just you could never like masticate and chew this many, you know, greens, but when you throw them into a, you know, a Vitamix blender and mix them up, you can down, you know, the equivalent of like, I don't know, eight handfuls in 10 minutes.
Exactly. Yeah. And they have oxalates in them. So, you know, I think rotating greens is also a really good thing to do. But yeah, and it's funny, I was just listening to a podcast from a doctor who I have.
[27:05] Respect for and he was talking about certain vegetables do have natural protective systems like the oxalates. There's a whole bunch of different ones. There's this whole movement through the carnivores. The carnivore diet is the latest fad. No, no. It's not the latest fad.
Okay.
The look is fad, and let me get you up to speed here.
Carnivore is so 2022. Okay. 2023 is the lion diet.
It's literally, it's meat and water and salt. That's it, the lion diet.
Oh no, that's not good. No, no.
Oh my gosh, yeah. So that kind of makes me crazy, but listening to this doctor talking about how, Yes. That's one of their chief complaints in these carnivore or lion diets is that.
[28:03] These plants have these chemicals in them. Lactans, lignans, all these things, yes.
Yeah, exactly. But that it's actually a really good thing for us because it helps our body almost be ... It's like keeping your immune system boosted and protecting us in ways that are important. So I think that it's really important to have all of those, the rainbow of color in your diet. So yeah. So when it comes to nourishing, I also believe that whatever your spiritual practice is, making time for it, nurturing those relationships. For me, having some girl time and getting out and doing things that I love to do with my friends is really important. Self-care is critical. So those are all, that's all part of nourishing. And of course, that.
[28:59] Yeah. What are some things that you like to get out and do with your friends?
Thrifting and Art as Forms of Meditation
[29:03] Oh, whether it's going, I love thrift shopping.
I'm also an upcycle artist. So I take funky clothes and I'll remake them into something totally crazy and different.
And I have a little Etsy shop and I call it my therapy because I've never been somebody that does well with meditation because I'm like triple type A and I have a very hard time just like sitting there and not having my thoughts go like ping pong balls in my head.
So my form of meditation or finding my Zen is to get into my studio and do my art or in the kitchen creating.
Those are like my two spaces. So thrifting with friends or going out for a hike or those kinds of things I just love.
And you talk about how it was your mother, Gloria, that really always encouraged your creativity.
Oh yeah, she was amazing with that. I mean, we would come home from school, my youngest brother and I, who's a little bit older than me, we'd come home from school and she'd have this old Formica top table.
[30:11] With a project on it, some kind of an art project.
And there were drawers and drawers and drawers of, you know, like a buffet of materials to do art with.
So it was always extremely creative and just loads of fun. And so yeah, grew up with a mom who was very creative.
[30:31] Well, that's great. And I know that you do like wire wrapping and glass drawing as well, right?
You did your homework. Yes, I do. I do. I like finding treasures like seashells and sea glass.
And we live on the Connecticut River where they built tall ships.
And my home is like 204 years old. and the beach had literally, that was like their dumping ground.
I collected glass by the bucket full. And I'm like, I gotta find something to do with this.
So I learned how to wire wrap it and make pendants out of it. It's so much fun.
Well, and you have a quote somewhere that I read that I liked it so much I wrote it down and it's, creativity requires the courage to let go of certainties, which to me, I dig that a lot.
[31:25] Thank you, yeah, I really think that's important. You know, you've gotta let the creative flow.
I was a former teacher, an early childhood teacher, and one of the things I used to encourage the teachers who worked with children when it related to art is to leave it open-ended, let that child create from the heart and not have structure to it.
Because every time a child learns through exploration, they're gonna discover something new.
And I feel like that when I'm in the kitchen, like every time I start taking ingredients, I'm learning something new, whether it's textures or it's flavors, or, you know, it's just a blast.
Yeah, you mentioned a book too, Living Artfully by Sandra Magsameh, Magsameh?
Living Artfully and Rediscovering Creativity
[32:19] Yes, she's so wonderful, yeah.
Yeah. And she does a lot with children, but that book definitely, because I think working in the corporate world, sometimes we stifle our creativity as adults.
And so reading that book really opened me back up to just letting that creative juice come back into my life.
[32:44] Yeah, I've got my youngest daughter is just, she will spend hours and hours and hours creating just things.
And whenever it's somebody's birthday or holiday or Christmas, she doesn't buy anything.
She doesn't wanna do that. She likes to make something.
And we always just treasure and love everything that she creates.
It's so, to me, it's so much more valuable than going out and buying it, you know, a trinket from a store that, you know, we're going to lose in three days.
And yeah, that is so special. It is, it is. And so we constantly are trying to.
[33:21] Sure to keep it up. Only nine now, but I love it. I love that living artfully very much.
I think we're on nourish. You want to go on to bloom?
Sure. Actually, bloom is what I would call the result of when we unearth and we weed out the obstacles and we nourish ourselves inside and out, we come into the full bloom of who we're meant to be. And that is in my, on the cover of the book, I've got this woman who's well-rooted, her core is strong, and she's holding this beautiful bouquet of like peonies flowers.
[34:04] And it's just, I think when we do the work, the real work, we have this beautiful bloom, and we become who we're meant to be. Simple as that.
Mm-hmm. Do you feel like you're in the the bloom phase? I better be. Oh, yeah. No, I am, Yeah, I am. I'm one of those crazy grandmas I've got a six-year-old and a three-year-old grandsons and, I'm like that grandma who is up on the slide and I'm sliding down with them and climbing the jungle gym And you know, I just I love it. Yeah, who would have thought 15 years ago. You'd be doing that Yeah, exactly. You better believe it. It's, you know, it's changed my life tremendously to get rid of that huge vest, the compressor. I mean, that was, you know, just traveling alone with that thing. It's like a 50-pound suitcase, you know, for just my vest. So.
Wow, are your are your parents alive still?
[35:08] No, my dad passed very young. He was only 64. He passed from heart disease. And my mom passed in 2012, and she had a rapid onset of dementia. And I think it was a combination of not only her diet, but also she was probably on about 18 different pharmaceuticals when she passed.
And I think that the pharmaceuticals that she was using, you know, for cholesterol and blood pressure and depression and, you know, I mean, just, I could go on and on.
I think they just literally fried her brain. So it's not that I'm anti medications, but I think that we've got such a better way of, you know.
Overmedication: The Dangers of Multiple Pharmaceuticals
[36:00] Coming into our health and, you know, not having to have those pharmaceuticals very, you know, so many of them.
And what I'm seeing is as people are aging, you know, they go to this doctor for one thing and they get put on one or two pharmaceuticals and then they go to another doctor for something else and they get put on another one.
And before they know it, they're on all these meds that, you know, the body is not always happy with that.
No, yeah, before you know it, you're on a constellation of medications and who knows what all those interactions create.
And I'm sure that that, I would imagine that you watching your mother.
[36:43] Go through a quick demise with Alzheimer's also played a role in you making a dramatic change in 2013.
Yeah, I think, you know, watching my dad even early on in my twenties, I, you know, with his heart disease, I knew then that, you know, I was on the low, you know, the fat-free diet back then, you know, and actually some of Dr. Ornish, you know, some of those things, my brother actually reversed his heart disease in his 40s through Dr. Ornish's diet.
So you know, I was aware of these things back then. I definitely made changes, not where I am today by any means, but yeah, it makes such a difference.
I watch so many people consuming handfuls of cheese nonstop.
They're so addicted to cheese and I just think, oh my goodness, what is that doing to your insides right now? So yeah. No, no.
Cheese. Jeez, oh man, that is like, as we like to say, that is some hardcore dairy crack right there.
Yep, fires up the brain.
So what do you, so in HealthDub, do you have any.
Plant-Based Cheese Substitutes: Nutritional Yeast and Ground Cashews
[38:02] What do you use instead of cheese in your recipes if you use a substitute?
Yeah, so I don't like a lot of the plant-based cheeses that are on the market because they're so full of different oils, primarily coconut oils.
Some of them have that yucky tapioca starch and I don't know, too many chemicals in them for me and too much fat.
So what I've used often is nutritional yeast.
Sometimes I'll grind up like my cashew parm. I grind up some cashews.
I use it sparingly because nuts have a lot of fat, but to sprinkle it on top of my plant-based lasagna.
So I'll mix some ground up cashews with a fresh clove of garlic and some nutritional yeast.
And that gives that cheesy flavor on top of my, more Mediterranean, Italian cooking.
[39:02] But other than that, I don't really miss it at all. Like there isn't, you know, I don't really have a cheese.
Yeah. I think I've been away from it for so long that I just don't, I don't crave it at all.
I hear you, you're preaching to the choir on that.
[39:19] What do you do on pizzas? Do you do, do you add anything like a nutritional yeast or cashews, or do you just do the veggies and the sauce?
Just really the veggies and the sauce. I love the sauce so much, you know, a good marinara, you know, and all those veggies.
I love roasted red peppers, but yeah, I just, you know, those things really just fill me up.
I love it, and they taste so good.
You mentioned a lasagna dish that you make.
I know when you're in health dup, you have an easy peasy lasagna that looks incredible.
You also have right above that, you have a breakfast lasagna.
I've never heard those two words used next to each other before.
A breakfast lasagna. What is your breakfast lasagna?
Oh my goodness, I'd have to look at it, but I'm pretty sure it's my oat recipe.
I can tell you right now, do you have your book?
Yeah, I do. It's on page 99. So reference that. Yeah, and then there it is.
Yeah, I was saying earlier that, um, This is the one with oats and I'm I am a real oat snob. Okay, I Have a favorite brand, Am I allowed to share what brand please do and I want to know if it you know, it coincides with mine, Okay. Well, it's one degree.
[40:46] They have a Sprouted. Oh, I love sprouted oats, especially for people that um have gut health issues because anything that sprouted is going to be a little more digestible digestible, They're also gluten free for anybody who is gluten intolerant And they also are glyphosate free, And glyphosate is a real issue with common crops like oats and wheat and things like that So I really encourage my clients to stay on on organic versions, sprouted if you can.
I like Ezekiel bread for those people that tolerate gluten because it's just, it's that whole food.
But my oats, one degree, because they are certified glyphosate-free, gluten-free, sprouted, and organic.
[41:34] And I've been able to get like five pound bags at Costco for like 10 bucks.
So I eat oats every morning because they're soluble, insoluble fiber.
They're a resistant starch. So they're just like super good for the gut.
They've got that high fiber. But yeah, so this is just basically using oats, flax meal, a cup of fresh fruit, dried fruits, nuts, seeds, if you want to add a little bit of that.
I love putting cinnamon, some of those, which helps with blood sugar.
I love cinnamon. Cardamom is also really good.
I've heard that cinnamon's got some pretty unique properties.
Yeah, cinnamon's so good. And then, you know, five cups of water, whatever, but the recipe is in there.
And basically it's lovely because for Christmas morning, you can bake this, you know, oat casserole, if you will, or oat lasagna, and then serve it in squares with, you know, some beautiful greens or whatever.
It's just so yummy.
Yeah. So it's served as kind of a, so you bake it.
Yeah, you bake it. Got it. Got it. And it comes out like solid, and then you cut it into squares, you know, almost like a piece of lasagna.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I like that a lot.
[42:55] Do you mind if we talk about a few of the recipes that you have in here?
Yeah, go for it. Yeah, so why don't you go to page 60, and let's talk about your apricot Swiss chard.
Oh yeah. I love, I have this thing about apricots. I don't know what it is. I just love them.
I love, you know, the dried apricots. I also love apricot jam.
The fruit juice sweetened jam is so yummy.
So yeah, this is just a great way for people who don't like the bitterness of greens to add a little bit of sweetness in there. So yeah, I've got some dried apricots, some veggie broth.
The apricot preserves, a little garlic and onion powder. And I put a little pinch of sea salt in there, but just sauteing them and having that sauce on there, you know, is a really great way for people to transition.
And my husband's not a big fan of greens, but he likes this.
Like he loves the little bit of sweetness in there. So that's a favorite.
Yeah, it caught my eye for sure. Another thing that I really love them, but I don't ever buy them because I'm like, I don't wanna spend $8.99 on two ounces of kale chips.
Making Delicious Kale Chips
[44:11] But you have two different kale chips recipes. You have a kale chips and then a sweet kale chips.
What can you tell me about making your own kale chips?
Oh gosh, okay. So first of all, washing them and then drying them really well.
So once you've washed them, you wanna get all the wet stuff out.
And then I get my hands in it, make sure your hands are nice and washed and then you make your sauce, whether it's your sweet one or your savory one, and then you massage the kale with whatever that sauce is, and you wanna lay it out on a nice big cookie sheet.
I usually do it on parchment paper, so it's easy cleanup.
And then bake them at a low temp for, you know, I watch them 15 to 30 minutes, somewhere in there, and just so they're lightly crisp.
And I made several batches for, I was doing this thing with a colleague at a super food social. We had so much fun.
People who are not into kale chips went bonkers for my kale chips.
So yeah, they're quite yummy.
Let's talk for a second about nightshades. So I love potatoes, tomatoes.
I don't like eggplant, but tomatoes and potatoes.
[45:33] You recommend that for people that are having some inflammation issues to then remove the nightshades.
And I would have thought that was completely bonkers, but I actually ran into a woman who told me she had this arthritis and it wasn't until she removed the nightshades, that it really went away.
So I'm wondering, there must be something about the nightshades that is, for certain people, inflammatory promoting.
[45:59] Yeah. Again, I don't know the specific chemical reaction as far as how that works.
I just know that for some people, there is an intolerance.
I often though believe, Rip, that when somebody's system is so out of balance and their gut health is so out of balance and they've been living on processed foods and a heavily animal-based diet, and their system is squeaking at them left and right, I call it body talk, but whatever their body is telling them, whether it's their weight or their joints are aching or they're getting chronic headaches or they've got all these different symptoms under the sun, then what I usually encourage them to do is begin to eliminate the processed foods, decrease the animal-based foods, add in more plant-based foods. But for somebody specifically who's having these joint issues and the inflammation, sometimes we try eliminating the nightshades and then add one of them back at a time. So, you know, bring the potatoes back in and see how you tolerate them.
Um, but once we get that body in, in a better homeostasis, we get it balanced through better nutrition.
[47:27] Quite often, those people who say, Oh, I'm allergic to avocados, or I'm allergic to this, or I don't tolerate gluten, or I don't tolerate this, that, or the other thing, um, will often be able to start tolerating those things and, and adding more of those things back in.
So, I don't think it's an allergy per se, but just your body's so out of balance, it's not tolerating certain things.
Yeah.
Food Intolerances and Alternatives
[47:53] Is there anything that today that you don't or can't tolerate?
[48:00] Gluten. I really have a hard time with gluten. And I keep trying, like I want so badly to have the Ezekiel bread and certain other things that I just love.
Like your pizza crust, but I just, for whatever reason, gluten is not my friend.
And I literally will feel four months pregnant when I have gluten.
And it takes me a good three days before that yuckiness in my gut goes away.
So, you know, I've really looked at alternatives.
[48:38] Is there any vegetable that you do not like? Hot peppers.
That's the only one. I can't take the hot spice. Like, it just, it ruins my taste buds for everything else on my plate. So- Are we talking like a habanero or are we talking a jalapeno?
What category? Both.
Both. Okay. You want a poblano? Yeah. You want poblanos?
Nope. Nope. Nothing hot. No, I can tell, I love mild salsa. I don't know.
I don't know. Yeah. So another recipe that I really like because it reminds me of something that we make in our home, it's called hobos.
You don't make them quite the same way, but it's on page 83.
It's your veggie campfire packs. Oh, gosh.
[49:27] Yeah. Will you speak to that? Yeah, absolutely.
That's funny because my husband is still animal-based, likes his animal protein, which is frustrating for me, but it's just the way life is.
We agree to not be the food police in our household, and I'll respect whatever it is that he needs to do.
The beauty of these is they're great for people that don't like to cook, and they're easy peasy cleanups.
A nice sheet of parchment paper. I like to layer my vegetables.
I usually make some kind of a sauce, whether I'm using a balsamic vinegar or a barbecue sauce, or yeah, there you go.
Easy and nutritious dinner with veggie packs in parchment paper
[50:14] You know, and I just layer all different kinds of veggies in there.
And if he wants a piece of animal protein, I'll put a piece of chicken in there.
You know, you add your sauce, you roll it up and you cinch the parchment paper all around the edges, throw it in the oven.
I usually do it at 425 for 35 minutes on a cookie sheet and you pull them out, open one end carefully because of the steam, throw it on a plate and you've got an entire dinner from that one little packet.
And sometimes I'll keep like, you know, cooked brown rice or some cooked quinoa in the freezer, like by the serving.
[50:57] That out, even as it's frozen, put a lump of that in my veggie packs and just cook them up.
And it's easy, quick dinner, and it's so nutritious and it tastes really good, especially in the winter months when you're cold in the Northeast anyways.
Yummy, yummy. So you mentioned your husband and how your husband does occasionally eat meat.
You also mentioned in your book, Healthed Up, that your husband actually went through a pretty severe chronic illness where you thought he might potentially die.
What, can you tell me what happened there?
Yeah, he, this is a man who never took a sick day practically in his life, healthy as a horse all his life, you know, relatively thin and active and just on the go.
And we did not know it, but he had an aneurysm lying dormant in his aorta.
And as he was aging, he was dealing with some blood pressure issues and wasn't keeping it under control, wasn't tolerating the medication they were giving him.
[52:03] We had no idea that the aneurysm was there and he went and deadlifted our dock system that we go put in the water every year.
And it caused the internal layer of the aorta to split.
And he started with a bleed. And so two weeks later, and it had basically shut down the blood flow to the colon.
So he wasn't able to move his bowels and it ended up ripping pretty severely.
He had a nine and a half inch dissection in his descending aorta.
And 30 days in the ICU, he has now a Dacron aorta, that they replaced one and a half feet of his aorta. He's missing two ribs on his left side.
And unfortunately we're dealing with a whole nother aneurysm that they discovered on one of the scans and this one is not operable. So keeping his blood pressure in check is absolutely critical.
Well luckily you know exactly the best way to do that. Yep. But you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make them drink.
[53:18] Yep. Well, we, we, we've talked about that in the podcast before and we're well aware of that.
Um, let me ask you this, so you're gluten-free, all your recipes are gluten-free, is there a certain gluten-free grain that you like to work with more than any other?
Gluten-free grain favorites: oat flour, chickpea flour, and almond flour
[53:38] Uh, yeah, so the, the two, my two most favorites, um, so when I'm baking cookies or cakes and things like that, I use, it's Anthony's Gluten-Free Organic Oat Flour.
Um, that is my favorite flour that acts very much like a whole wheat flour.
[54:00] Um, I don't use any things like xanthan gums and all of that cause they can be real gut disruptors as well, all of those emulsifiers.
So I avoid those.
Um, I also don't use baking powder because of gut health. I'll use baking soda in its place.
Um, I like chickpea flour for savory things.
Um, if I want to thicken something or a gravy, I'll sometimes use the chickpea flour.
Um, and then my other go-to for making crusts, like to make a tort or a, you know, any kind of like a chickpea pie or something like that, I will use, um, sometimes almond flour mixed with some other things.
I love like soaking some dates, some organic dates, and then blending them or processing them in a food processor with some almond flour, always organic almond flour, because they're the most heavily sprayed fruit on the planet.
[54:57] Wow. What about a whole intact grain? Is it millet? Is it amaranth?
Is it brown rice? Do you have a favorite one of those?
[55:09] I love quinoa. I love brown rice. I love millet. I love amaranth. Um...
So those are definitely, buckwheat is another, I love buckwheat noodles.
Oh, yum, yum, yum. So, you know, making those into like an Asian cuisine is so good.
But yeah, those are definitely my go-to grains. I haven't met a grain I don't like that's, you know, gluten-free, so.
Yeah, yeah. Well, there's so many and there's such a great variety of textures and flavors and all that.
All right, we're rounding home here, but- I need to ask you about, on page 105.
[55:52] One of my favorite things to make for the kids, we love doing walnut taco meat tacos, I guess walnut taco meat tacos.
It looks like you do too. What can you tell me about your walnut tacos?
Oh my gosh, they're so easy. I mean, yeah, I just use the organic walnuts, some chili powder, garlic powder, cumin, paprika, some turmeric, which is so good for reducing inflammation, and a pinch of sea salt.
And I process them in a food processor until they're ground, like taco meat.
And I can't wait to know what you do next, because what I do next is the key step in making the walnut meat just right.
And I haven't read your description of what to do, so I can't wait to hear it.
Yeah, well, that's pretty much it for me. I'd love to hear your secret, but I put them in, often I'll put them in collard greens or romaine lettuce just to get more greens in them, you know, and top it with sprouts and shredded chopped veggies.
And, you know, sometimes I'll put on plant-based yogurt or even some, you know, guacamole, a little dab of that, but there's a lot of fat in the walnuts, so you gotta be careful with that. But...
[57:07] Yeah, that's pretty much it. Or sometimes I put a big ball jar and I'll put the walnut meat at the bottom.
And then I layer all different kinds of veggies in there. And then, you know, when I'm ready to eat it, I just take my fork and stir it all together and eat it.
And those are great for on the road.
So what I do is I put it in the blender, but just for a little bit.
I find if you do it too long, it becomes too much of just a mash, and I want it to be kind of individualized, and so I just do a couple pulses in the blender, and then I put it into a skillet, and then I add all the spices, and then I add literally, depending upon how much walnuts I have in there, just a smidgen of water.
It's got to be the right amount. If you do too much, it just turns into this big gel, and then I stir it, and then I let it heat up, and then it literally, it all kind of comes apart, and it almost looks like hamburger meat.
Wow, that's so cool. Anyway, so that's what I do with the walnut meat, and it works really well.
Yeah. But very cool to see.
[58:19] And adding those spices in the pan, really just the aroma of it, it really brings out the flavor of the spice by giving them a little bit of heat.
Big time. You know what I want to talk about now is, I want to talk about the drawings in your book, because I just think that, I don't know who did these, if you did them or you hired somebody to do them, but they're gorgeous.
Appreciating the beautiful drawings in the book and their story
[58:48] It looks like something like from Audubon.
I mean- Well, it's a kind of a funny story, Rip. Okay. So, you know, on the cover of the book, you see my dress?
Yes. I always go the wrong way. Okay, so when I was working with my publisher, so first I had that photo done in celebration of my 60th birthday.
And yes, and so that photo was taken about a year and a half ago.
And when I decided to take the photo, I knew I wanted to wear something bright and cheery.
And I went through my closet and in the very back of the closet was this dress, that I bought 40 years ago on my honeymoon in Hawaii.
[59:32] And I thought, I still love that dress, but it didn't fit for some time because of weight gain.
And so I had been on the whole food plant-based journey and eight pounds came off very easily.
I went and put that dress on and it fit like a glove, just like when I was 21 years old.
So I'm now 61, my dress still fits. And so, excuse me, when...
[59:59] Gave my publisher that picture and said, I need this to be in the book somehow. And she goes, well, since your dress is vintage, which blew my mind. I'm like, I didn't think of myself as vintage. She chose some graphics and I don't know where she got them all, but she decided to go with these vintage pictures, you know, and I just, I love them. I just love the look, the feel of them.
Well, it's just really classy. It's really classy.
Yeah. They're colorful, and they just really represented the Whole Foods, the color in my life, the full bloom, and I guess the vintage side of me.
Very, very much. So this is, I want to close with this quote that you have. I think it's.
[1:00:53] On your website, but you believe in the magic of miracles, the good in others, the power of action and the healing power of love, lifestyle, and good food. I love every word in that statement.
You'd like to say about that?
Oh, thank you. Yeah. You know, for a while I used to say just an ordinary girl making magic.
And I just feel like, you know, those those are the things that have just fueled me through the years.
They just they bring me joy and they've helped me to thrive.
So, yeah, those are just that's my basic philosophy.
Yeah. Well, we I love it.
The Importance of Taking Action for Your Health
[1:01:39] Janet, before we go, anything that you'd like to say, any events you have coming up, anything Anything you'd like to plug?
The only thing I will say, and I just posted this recently, is if you don't change your lifestyle, your lifestyle may change you.
And I've seen this happen too often. So keep listening to those little signs and symptoms in your body and take action, take baby steps, but do something to get your health back.
I love it. Janet, I gotta have you back on again and we can talk about the nine R's of losing weight.
Sounds good. With that, hey, hit me up with a little Plant Strong fist bump, all right?
Plant Strong. Thank you.
Thank you, Janet. Thank you.
[1:02:30] What a wonderful conversation with Janet. I loved how she said that you have to believe that you can get well, but along with belief comes the passionate work, of nourishing yourself on the inside and outside.
And great news, Janet is one of our Brockstars for this year's virtual Planstock event that, takes place from September 22nd to the 24th, all on YouTube.
Stay tuned for more information on how to register and make sure that you're following our social media at Go Plan Strong on both Instagram and Facebook.
The theme of this year's Planstock is coming together and we can't wait to come together all over the world with some of the best plant-based chefs ever. Thanks so much.
Support the PlantStrong podcast for exciting news about plants.
[1:03:22] Thank you for listening to the PlantStrong podcast. You can support the show by taking a quick minute to follow us wherever you listen to your favorite podcasts. Leaving us a positive review and sharing the show with your network is another great way to help us reach as many, people as possible with the exciting news about plants. Thank you in advance for your support.
It means everything. The PlantStrong podcast team includes Carrie Barrett, Laurie Kortowich, Ami Mackey, Patrick Gavin, and Wade Clark. This season is dedicated to all of those courageous, truth seekers who weren't afraid to look through the lens with clear vision and hold firm to a higher truth. Most notably, my parents, Dr. Caldwell B. Esselstyn, Jr. and Anne Crile Esselstyn.
Thanks for listening.
