#256: Richard Hubbard - From Morbidly Obese, to Plant-Based Athlete and Advocate
Rich meets Rip!
After college, Richard Hubbard felt hopeless. It was a stressful time looking for a steady job, he wasn’t moving as much as he did in college, and he loved candy and junk food - not a great combination for a web and graphic designer who would spend hours sitting at his desk during the day.
Rich also avoided doctors because he didn’t need a doctor to tell him what he already knew. He was nearing 350 pounds and destined to a life of medications if he didn’t make changes.
Ironically, it was a doctor and a mandatory physical that changed everything. Well, it wasn’t the doctor as much as it was Rich’s desire to research the best way to reverse his hypertension. That solution? You guessed it…a plant-forward diet.
In one year, Richard lost over 120 pounds. Since then he has gone on to lose at least 30 more and he’s become a lean, mean, muscle machine with a whole foods, plant-based approach.
Today, he shares his formula for lasting weight loss with nutrient-dense meals, batch cooking, and reducing sodium intake for optimal health and blood pressure. He is passionate about giving back to the community and has even become a nutrition coach and an author. His book A Plant Based Journey To Health: From Morbidly Obese To Plant-Based Athlete is available now.
Episode Highlights
1:12 Richard's Wake-Up Call and Transformation Begins
19:06 Researching Hypertension Reversal and Plant-Based Diets
20:34 Resisting Medication and Family Health Influences
26:37 The Decision to Undergo Skin Removal Surgery
27:38 What He Eats to Maintain his Weightloss and Muscle Mass
30:10 Transitioning to a Smarter, Plant-Based Approach
51:58 His Mom’s Health Transformation
1:00:33 Rich’s Relationship Status and Career Update
1:02:03 His Plant-Based Coaching Initiative
1:03:32 Sharing Success through Writing
About Richard Hubbard
From his website, www.plantbasedrich.com: “I lost over 150 pounds and have kept if off for over eight years now. It was a journey I never thought I would be able to accomplish. I understand the struggle to lose weight and how stressful dieting can be…
I am amazed as much as anyone that I managed to keep it off. For all the years of being heavy, you would think I would have regained the weight by now. But, as you’ll discover in this book, I doubt I will ever have to worry about obesity again. This way of eating allows me to eat as much as I want without resorting to counting calories…
Episode Resources
Order, A Plant Based Journey to Health
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Full Transcript via AI Transcription Service
[0:00] I'm Rip Esselstyn, and you're listening to the PLANTSTRONG Podcast. Last week, we interviewed Robert Cheek about his new book, The Impactful Vegan. This week, we talked with a gentleman who was profoundly influenced by Robert, and that guest today is Richard Hubbard. We'll share his rags-to-riches health story of dropping 150 pounds and becoming PLANTSTRONG. His secrets to success are right after these words from PLANTSTRONG.
[0:34] After college, Richard Hubbard felt hopeless. It was a stressful time looking for a steady job, and he wasn't moving as much as he was in college, and he loved candy and junk food. Not a good combination for a web and graphic designer who would spend hours sitting at his desk all during the day. Rich avoided doctors because he didn't need a doctor to tell him what he already knew. He was nearly 350 pounds and destined to a life of medications if he didn't
[1:10] wake up and make some changes quickly. Ironically it was a doctor in a mandatory physical that changed everything actually it wasn't so much the doctor as it was rich's desire to research the best way to reverse his hypertension and the solution you know it a plant forward diet one year later richard lost over 120 pounds and since then He's gone on to lose another 30, and he's become a lean, mean muscle machine. His secret, small, simple, repeatable actions that he takes every single day. Let's hear all about it right now with Richard Hubbard.
[2:00] Hey, Rich Hubbard, welcome to the PLANTSTRONG Podcast. What is going on in your world? Hey, Rip, I'm really happy to be here. It's a pleasure to meet you last year, and it's awesome to be a part of your podcast today. Well, you have quite the rags-to-riches health story, and I can't wait to get into it. Yeah, you're right. We met last, we think it was last summer, and it was in... Exam Room Podcast. It was in New York City. It was at the PCRM kind of gala honoring kind of the Exam Room Podcast. They were doing a live broadcast.
[2:42] It was, of course, Chuck Carroll was there. He was the host. We had Dr. Neil Barnard. We had Dr. Michelle McMacken. We had Dr. Robert Osfeld. And it was, they did a really nice job. And beforehand, they had a little, you know, meet and greet. And that's where i met you and you came up you approached me and you let me know about your incredible uh journey to plant-based nutrition and what it's done for you losing over are you over 150 pounds now it's probably over 160 pounds now 160 yeah and how many years has it been since you've lost the weight? Well, I lost 120 the first year. Probably took me 11, 12 months to reach 120 pounds. And gradually over the years, it was another 30, 40 pounds. Right. And you've successfully been able to keep it off, right? Oh, yeah. Yeah. I've never regained it since then. Right. So tell me this. Are you...
[3:48] Do you have brothers and sisters? I have one sister who unfortunately passed. She had an eating disorder for years.
[3:57] Yeah. It was sort of expected because she was going downhill for years. But, yeah, she's my only sibling. Got it. Got it. Well, sorry about that. Tell me, and so, Rich, growing up, at what age did you happen to notice that you were um getting getting heavier and heavier well i was never super skinny as a kid i mean i i was never really fat i would say that i probably was a little chunky i guess but it wasn't really that heavy it wasn't until after college really um but growing up though i did have the standard american diet i love candy and go out for halloween try not to eat the whole bag but that was hard to do back then and i did eat a lot um especially junk food i love candy um you know reese's was my weakness back then one of my favorites um but any candy you leave it in front of me back then and i would eat it um i love fast food.
[5:06] Um, my mom did make healthier foods, but what, well, at least what I thought that were healthy back then, but still there was a lot of junk food around, you know, she did encourage salads, uh, at least at supper time. So it's not like, um, there's never healthy foods around, but I definitely crave the bad stuff.
[5:28] Yeah. You mentioned Reese's peanut butter cups. that I think a lot of people have a weakness for those. They have just the right combination of everything from that chocolate, the peanut butter, the salt, the sugar. On a good day, how many Reese's peanut butter cups could you down at once? Depends on how many were there.
[5:50] Well, my dad would typically buy us maybe a candy bar a day. So they did try to control our appetite somewhat that if there was extra around the house, I would eat it. Got it. And so you mentioned that when you really started to gain weight was in college. Yeah, well, after college. Oh, after college. after college and uh and why is that what was it about after college that was the right kind of confluence of events that allowed you to start gaining more weight uh well when i graduated college it was tough to find a job at first so um i think it was just a stressful time and i turned to food um to cope with the stress and when i um finally located um a steady job you know uh it took uh maybe a year or two um that was a place where there's a lot of junk food around and i i felt like um remember the commercial with uh mikey uh i forget what cereal was life cereal yeah um they they all said give it to me you know i'll eat it it's There's practically any food that was there, I would eat it. And they knew it, and they brought in lots of food and, you know, Burger King.
[7:12] You name the fast food, they brought it in, the candy, and I would eat it all. And I wasn't exercising like I was in college. You know, I went to college in New York. And when you're in New York, it's impossible to not do a lot of exercise because I would do so much walking. And I kept my weight down that way. But I did have the bad diet in college as well, though. It's not like I was eating healthy there. But with all the exercise, you know, it's impossible to gain weight during that time. But all that stopped when I graduated college. I was back in Connecticut. You know, I had my car, so I didn't have to do as much walking.
[7:56] And just bad habits. I would sit all day being a graphic designer and web designer. Yeah um i i would sit all day long i remember um, Before I adapted this healthy lifestyle, I remember one time I was sitting for probably eight hours straight. And I remember my legs would feel so stiff and like they were going to give out just standing up. And I knew that wasn't a good thing. So I was really gradually ruining my health. Well, and what you just mentioned there is something that I would say the vast majority of Americans have some sort of a desk job.
[8:37] Sitting sitting for six to eight hours straight maybe to get up to go to the bathroom or grab something to eat but uh you're right sitting is toxic absolutely yes it really is yeah i mean that's that's why i have to say i love the apple watch yeah it reminds me every hour to stand so if i'm uh in a zone and working on something you know i take that reminder serious and get moving yeah well so every every hour then on the hour when your apple watch dings what do you do do you do squats do you go for a walk what do you do uh i go for a quick walk um you know walk to the restroom if i don't have to because all the way at the other end of the hall and just making sure i get enough steps in um maybe take a 10 minute break and what's your what's your what's your goal these days with steps how many steps you try and get well i never i mean i'm only human i probably skipped a day or two um you know being sick or whatever but ever since 2012 it's been 10 000 plus steps a day usually it's average about 12 000 steps a day you know some days are more like 20 000 depending on where i am but i religiously never go below 10 000 wow that's um you're very committed to your steps. I am. I'm too afraid of being inactive after losing the weight. Wow.
[10:06] So it sounds like the only thing that you're as committed to is your diet. Yes. The way you eat. Yep. Absolutely. 100%. So let's circle back to that. But first, if you don't mind, I want to dive a little bit deeper into how how your weight gradually ballooned and ballooned and ballooned so yeah what what what weight were you at after you graduated from college i'd say it was probably 230 okay probably right around there 230 and then and then i'm 63 so and you're what i'm 63 and And you're 6'3". Yeah. And how long did it take you to get to your weight of 350 pounds?
[10:57] Well, I think the weight came on probably quickly. I mean, I remember being unhealthy all through the late 90s, all through the 2000s until 2012. I'd say it probably took a couple of years to get to my peak weight. I stopped weighing myself at 345, so I don't know how high I really got, But I didn't make any changes back then. It's just for some psychological reason, I didn't want to see it go over 350. So I thought, let's tell myself that I'm not that heavy, you know. Right. Well, and so going from 230 to 310, 320, 330, how does your body deal with that? And how did you feel? Oh, I wasn't feeling good. I really wasn't. I noticed I was starting to get neuropathy the last few years before I lost the weight in my feet, and I thought that's a bad sign. And my mom was a diabetic at the time. I'll get into that later on, how she reversed it. And it was in my family. So I thought, oh, my God, I might be turning diabetic. But still, I didn't make enough changes.
[12:20] I found out I was pre-diabetic at my first physical, but I was getting all these symptoms. I was tired. I didn't have much energy. I also got depressed parts of the 2000s. I remember feeling really low for a while. And I was never clinically diagnosed with depression back then, but I was definitely not feeling my usual self. Right um how would you so how would you deal with that when you got a little bit you know down or depressed which is kind of food yeah uh thankfully i was i never did drugs i was never into that um i was never a drinker so substance abuse was never an issue but it's always the food so it was food food abuse not substance exactly exactly.
[13:16] And how old are you now? I'm 49, 49. So in 2024. So, okay. So you were in your thirties when you started kind of, yes, yes. Gaining, gaining the weight. Oh yeah. Yeah. Pretty much all my thirties. Uh, I was heavy until the very end. Yeah. And so like, walk me through like, so how do you, again, like talk to me, like, what does a day or a week of food look like when you're getting, going from 230 to your 330 or 340? I mean, is it just fast food? Is it like 15 soda pops a day? Is it 20 pieces?
[14:00] I have no idea. Pretty much all that. Yeah, to start with, I would usually go to some kind of fast food like McDonald's. I used to love their McMuffins. And I wouldn't just order one. I'd order five. It was insane. Insane and i i remember figuring out the calories uh one time this was after i was healthy i remembered my diet um and it was over 10 000 calories a day no idea how i survived a day it was just insane and i think it's miraculous i i didn't have worse worse health conditions than i did but anyway i had um egg mcbuffins okay i remember having five five yes okay depending on my day i mean sometimes three or whatever but you know i i could go for five um you know i'd go to mcdonald's um for for uh dinner i remember i would get like um what were they two um trying to think what they were called it wasn't the quarter pounder was um the mcrib or the for some reason i didn't like the mcrib it was always but anyway something like a quarter pounder you know i had the cheese and the ketchup mustard yeah and uh yeah i was addicted to mcdonald's i would love the fries.
[15:22] Uh, you know, just, just way too much food. Well, what, and what about, what would you drink during the day? I thought I was helping myself with the diet soda, which I know definitely wasn't helping. So was that loaded with aspartame? Yeah. And so how many, how many diet sodas would you have during the day? Probably two liter. Two. Okay. Yep. I would pour it into my water bottle when it was gone, add some more, and really bad habits.
[15:55] And so were you eating any fruit and vegetables back then, or was it just highly processed? I did like fruit. That's the interesting thing. And I did like veggies. It was never that I didn't like them. It's because I didn't eat enough of them. I used to eat apples often. Maybe I'd have an apple a day. I still eat apples. Uh in fact i eat two apples a day now but anyway um back then it was um you know maybe an apple or strawberries uh i did eat um some veggies just not enough um you know i i would eat maybe some broccoli once in a while but never enough all right so two apples a day you're doing now you always like apples any particular type of apple that you are drawn to you know i love the The Pink Lady and the Honeycrisp. Uh-huh. That was very organic, no? Yeah. Those are two good apples for sure. I like the Macoon and the Pacific Rose. Those are probably my favorite. I haven't tried the Pacific Rose. I haven't seen it around here, but... Pacific Rose. It's only available during a limited, like, limited, like, month or two during the year, and they come from New Zealand. So next time you see the Mac Rose, grab it.
[17:15] So, Rich, you're kind of starting to spiral out of control with your health, your weight, your blood pressure, cholesterol, diabetes, all that. What what was your wake up call in 2012? I finally had to do a physical. I'm so grateful for the state of Connecticut because they were changing their insurance requirements back then. At first I thought it's a drag and you know I didn't want to go to the doctor and I hated the thought of it but in order to get um premiums that were affordable I'd have to um get a fiscal yeah and that saved my life because I I'm even today I wonder how long would I put it off um if I didn't have that fiscal so that fiscal woke me up I um I reluctantly found a doctor I I used Google, found one in my area, and he confirmed what I already knew. He said the words that always scared me, that I was morbidly obese.
[18:20] He used those words too, yeah. I know I was obese, but just hearing those words, that was scary for me. Yeah. And can you remember how he delivered that news to you? Were you both sitting down and was you looking in his eyes and said, hey? Yeah, this was the first physical. He told me straight out, and I need to do something about it. He recommended back then that I join Weight Watchers. I think back then, during my physical, Weight Watchers had some program for Weight Watchers for men. But I never did that. I wanted to do my own research, and I'm glad I did. Okay. So you went home after that appointment with the doctor.
[19:02] Yep. And what did you do? How did you do your own research? search? Well, the first thing, actually, I went home, but did research about weight loss, but that's not what changed me. It was a follow-up appointment because he did a follow-up because he wanted to see if my blood pressure would go down. He threatened to do meds if my blood pressure wasn't better the next appointment. So I think it was like two or three weeks later and my blood pressure was still high.
[19:32] So he put me on meds and I didn't want to go on meds. I remember telling my mom at the time that I'm going to have to go on meds. And she said, everybody's on something. No big deal. She's a nurse and she gets meds all the time. So it's like, she thought it was a part of everybody's life. You know, just, you know, as you get older, you're going to be on meds. Well let me ask you this rich rich what was it about meds in your mind that made them so distasteful to you you know what it was it was um, I didn't like any lab work either at the time because I was so out of touch with everything medical. I avoided everything for years. So I read one of the side effects was, oh, you have to do follow-up lab work every three months or six months. I thought, I don't even like to do it yearly. So that was a factor. And when I read all the other side effects.
[20:31] I thought, well, I want to see if I can do this on my own. And to be honest i don't know how i got this drive because um my dad he was on probably like 20 meds at the time you know he was the type to take one med to cover the side effects of another yeah and my stepmom was the same way too so yeah if all these people around me who are heavily medicated and they weren't really getting better you know i i see my dad he's got got various problems over the years um you know most recently you got giant cell arteritis i'm not sure if you're familiar with that uh inflammation of the arteries but all these conditions over the years that i saw them develop they have insomnia and i didn't want to go down that road um my dad would always say to me for years uh wait till you get my age you know you're going to have all these conditions so it's almost like i'm fighting back in my mind i don't want to um be who they are at that age you know i don't want to be uh relying on meds i don't want to have the insomnia and all these other issues that they're dealing with you know.
[21:44] Constipation that my stepmom deals with i just didn't want any of that no no i good for you for not wanting any of the normal right yeah exactly and as soon as yeah all it took was googling um how to reverse hypertension at the time that led me to some plant-based diets i didn't know at the time i was eating plant-based but the foods they were telling me to eliminate eventually turned into a plant-based way of eating right and so that was in 2012 yes and so what did Because I know that you didn't go full bore or full kale until 2016.
[22:27] So what did 2012 to 2016 look like, and how much weight were you able to lose doing it that way? I did lose a lot of weight. I mean, that's where I lost the first 120 pounds during that first year. But I'd say I was going toward whole food plant-based that first year. Some people are plant-based and still eat meat. So I guess you could say I was plant-based but still had minimal.
[22:54] You know, um, poultry at the time until 2016, but it really was a plant-based diet. You know, as I gradually learned more and more foods to cut out, um, the only animal product I had during that time was probably, um, turkey, which, uh, I'm so glad I gave up, but, um, And also eggs and yogurt. So those three foods I would eat probably almost daily back then, but the small servings, really the bigger servings were the veggies. Right. The salad took over, as Dr. Furman's advice I learned in 2012. Yeah. Yeah, I would have huge salads. So it was the veggies that were helping. Good. So you were doing it, probably sounds like 90% right. Right. Exactly. Except for the stragglers of the eggs, the turkey and the yogurt. Any particular type of yogurt that you that you like? Yeah. And at the time, I don't know how I got it down because I hate the taste of it. It was the Fasce Greek yogurt. It was the no sugar added.
[24:03] And at first I hated the taste of it. I forced myself because it was so high in protein. I know better at the time. And here I had a personal trainer telling me up the protein. So that was my go-to protein and i hated the taste of it oh yeah i want to so i want to come back to your trainer and how much protein he wanted you to be consumed on a daily basis but first so you were able to lose 120 plus pounds that first year that's right that's pretty substantial and i know something that you you were dealing with that everybody i think deals that has gotten large and then lost a substantial amount of weight, and that is loose skin. And so tell me, where are you with your, I guess, your fight with loose skin? Yeah, that's a great question. I'm very fortunate in that my neck actually came back because when I looked at the pictures back then, I didn't really have much difference between the chin and the neck. My arms came back with the strength training. I mean, I still have a little skin if I don't have enough muscle there. The muscle kind of disguised it. But the one area that never tightened on its own was my belly.
[25:27] And I told myself for five years that if it doesn't tighten after five years, I'm going to do the tummy tuck. It was a really hard decision because, as you could tell with me avoiding doctors, I wasn't in favor of surgery either. But that was a necessary evil. I talked to many doctors. I even had a talk with Dr. Furman. He is straight up with everybody. You know how honest he is. So I told him, is there any way I do this with diet? and he told me the only way is with surgery, with that amount of skin.
[26:02] So I gave it five years because I know that, you know, with time, some skin settles. And it does, and it did settle in other places, but never in the belly. So I did my homework. I found a doctor in New York City, and I went with him. And it's been a decision I never regretted since because, you know, Seeing that skin in the mirror, I mean, I know it's also a reminder of where I was, but also the scars are a
[26:35] reminder of where I was, too. So it's not like I'm going to forget. And I think it's also an incentive to keep going, too, because I don't ever want that skin to expand again. Yeah. Does that make sense? Yeah. Well, good for you. It sounds like it was well thought out. You were very patient with it all. You know, you took five years and then after five years, you decided, OK, it's time for me to move on with this procedure.
[27:04] And I know several people that have that have had that procedure, one of which that I've had on the podcast several times. Adam said, yeah, I reached out to him, too. Yeah. He's he's another person who advised me. Yep. Yep. And I know that he he's very happy with the procedure and he wears those scars like you, like a bit of a badge of, you know, a badge of badge of honor. And he also uses them as a reminder of where he was. Exactly. Yeah. Because I'm not going to want to go back to the old ways, you know, waste thousands of dollars on the surgery.
[27:39] And also being vegan that really has helped me stay in line because as an ethical vegan now if somebody has something even if they say oh it's only, moderation what's the big deal as an ethical vegan there's no way I would eat that so let's circle back Rich to, I think this is part of you trying to gain muscle mass was because you're trying to deal with the loose skin. Yes. And so you had a trainer, a personal trainer, who advised you to eat how many grams of protein per day? 200 grams of protein a day. Just so people heard that, 200 grams of protein a day. That was insane. I just couldn't.
[28:31] Knowing what i know now is just insane and that was why you were doing those uh those high protein yogurts the reasons okay and he also um recommended whey at the time which i'm so grateful that i had an allergic reaction it wasn't for me so i went with a plant-based protein which i still, would avoid now but at least back then it was a better choice but still my doctor told me at the time and he's not even plant-based but he said 200 grams of protein i'm going to get liver and kidney problems if i stick with it so is this the same doctor that also looked you in the eye said that you were morbidly obese no no he he's since retired okay and was that doctor you're able to see the success that you've had yeah i shared it with him and what does he think of of what you've done oh he he was totally on board with everything i did yeah um except for, a follow-up appointment when i guess he forgot how i um ate because he says you mean you don't even eat fish or eggs so you know you think you get it by then but anyway so he knew you were plant-based and he thought you were still doing some fish and eggs yeah yeah it's the ignorance or it's out there. No. Yeah, it runs rampant. Definitely. It's everywhere. Um...
[29:57] So you, at what point did you decide, okay, eating 200 grams of protein a day is ridiculous.
[30:06] I need to go a smarter, more scientific route. And what led you to then Robert Cheek and kind of his counsel? Just doing Googling, vegan bodybuilders. I came up with this website. And honestly, he really changed my life. As much as Dr. Fuhrman did in 2012, I credit him for opening my eyes to being full-blown vegan.
[30:35] Him and I became great friends after that, too. He's an awesome guy, and I just want to thank him for that. He had this book called Shred It that I stumbled upon with Googling, and he wasn't talking about high protein. He wasn't mentioning, obviously, animal products, but all the other personal trainers I've seen over the years we're talking about. He was doing this on a plant-based diet. And he had a 13-week journal. And I thought, I'm going to give this a try. If he can do it, maybe I can too. And after 13 weeks, I was building better muscle than when I was eating animal products. Dr. Justin Marchegiani, And I was feeling better about myself. And remember, I thought in my mind that I was going to stop after 13 weeks. But I felt so great after the 13 weeks. I never wanted to go back. And watching videos, too, over the years, and I realized I was becoming more and more ethical about it. I didn't want to go back after that. That's fantastic.
[31:43] And do you know that it is our buddy our buddy rich uh robert cheek he just turned 44 yes a couple days ago and he just announced the launch of his new book the impactful vegan yeah i'm he gave me an advanced copy it's an awesome book yeah yeah that's fantastic well i'm gonna be sure to have excuse me be sure to have him on the podcast so he can talk all about his new book yeah yeah you're right he's been an incredible uh influence because also i became open about how i um ate after that my lifestyle because um before that i would shy away you know i would do vegan challenges um i wrote about in my blog even before i met robert cheek just because i thought oh you know it's a good way to kickstart weight loss and you know good to challenge myself but i i um you know those were only temporary challenges but when i um met robert cheek he was selling um the sweatshirt that says vegan on the back and he had a workout shirt um no meat no problem so i thought i'm gonna wear this during the 13 week challenge just you know be a good talking point for people at the gym and it was and um i love the reaction that he got and And, you know, people would say, oh, they can never do that. So I thought to myself, well, watch me. I'm going to build muscle with this shirt and I'm going to change your mind.
[33:13] So ever since then, I've been wearing vegan shirts at the gym. I have a huge variety, some kind of plant-based message that I want to get out there. So I want people to know that, you know, I'm vegan, but I work out hard. I'm building muscle. so I'm, you know, I'm taking care of my body, and it's not just weak little vegans out there. There's a variety of people that are vegan, and, you know, here's one example. Yeah, yeah. Tell me about what happened with some of your...
[33:53] Your numbers, like your blood pressure, your cholesterol over the course of your transition? Yeah, it's been incredible. My blood pressure is something like 150 over 110 or something like that, my first physical. And I messaged Chef AJ the other week because she was talking about her low blood pressure and people would be concerned. Mine was like 98 over 65 or something. Really? Yeah. And you go to a standard doctor, they're going to be concerned. But I have a plant-based doctor now, and he's totally impressed. And I know that that's where it's supposed to be. If you're not feeling dizzy, you feel normal at that blood pressure, then that's where it's supposed to be. Yeah. Who is your plant-based doctor? Can you share that or not? Yeah, I can.
[34:54] Uh, hold on. Let me say it's a lifestyle medicine doctor in Connecticut, Middletown. Okay. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. There's some, there's so many great lifestyle. He's not an online doctor. Um, yeah. Got it. Yeah. Okay. I'm sorry. I interrupted you. Go ahead. So you were talking about some of your numbers, your latest and greatest numbers. Yeah. So the blood pressure went down. The blood sugar, I was borderline diabetic. He didn't do an A1C at the time, which looking back, I don't know why he didn't because my blood sugar was higher than it should. I remember it was like 130 fasting or something. It was high. Um i guess he was waiting to see if it would come down which it did with my diet um but still, um watching the blood sugar go down over the years um the last time it was checked um my fasting blood sugar was 83 i had my a1c checked it was like 4.8 but i wish i knew what my a1c was back then that would have been a great comparison but just to compare the blood sugar alone fasting i think that it gives you a good picture oh yeah i bet you if you had a 130.
[36:13] Fasting blood sugar i bet you your a1c was somewhere in the sevens high six i wouldn't be surprised at all yeah yeah and that was even trying to eat healthier prior to that first physical you know i was trying my best i didn't lose any weight at that point but you know that was um can you imagine what it would have been if i was eating like the five mcmuffins I can't even imagine. What about your total cholesterol and LDL? Did you happen to know those? Oh, yeah. My cholesterol was over 200 at the time. I don't remember the exact numbers. My LDL was higher, too. It was over 150, I'm sure.
[36:53] But recently, my total cholesterol is like 126. My LDL was around 70 or 68 or something. so it was impressive my triglycerides are like 80 I think.
[37:09] Yeah. Those are some champion, champion numbers there. I work hard. I mean, I probably work too hard at the gym, but, you know, I don't want to go backwards. And even when I had a knee injury a couple of years ago and I wasn't working as hard, the numbers didn't change. You know, exercise is a small part of the equation, I think. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know if you might know my friend, Anthony Macielo. Absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah, he told me that he did his, he changed to plant-based diet without exercising the first year. And he reversed his hypertension as well that first year. Right. So it's not the exercise. It helps, but really 90, probably 95% is the diet. No, we see that over and over again. Really, you know, so much of this is what you're putting in your mouth. Exercise is so vitally important. But as far as losing the weight and bringing down those numbers and so many other things, I think the real the real culprit there is what's what's going into your mouth. And that helps on a multitude of other areas that just makes you feel like an absolute, you know, champ. For sure. For sure. Yeah. So tell me these. I mean, so you've been doing this.
[38:33] Bull kale since 2016. Yeah. How do you, do you cook for yourself? Do you have somebody that cooks for you? How do you, how do you, how do you work? I do some batch preparing, you know, prepare the salads ahead of time. Bake huge salads every day. You know, the oatmeal, I recently, actually, I think I told you when I had you on my podcast, they started to grow oats and I've stuck with those. Oh, good. I love those now. So what I do is I get ready for work, cook the oats, and they're done by the time I'm done getting ready. So I don't mind, you know, cooking that in the morning because it gives me time to get the berries ready and the flax and chia seeds. So and dinner is just. Let me stop you for a sec. What kind of berries do you are you usually eating? Usually I have blackberries, raspberries, and strawberries. Do you have frozen or fresh? Oh, well, I try to buy organic. If I can't get organic fresh, I get a frozen organic. Got it. Okay. So breakfast, it's the oat groats, berries.
[39:50] Oh, and before I forget, I've been wanting to find the plant oat, So the milk you mentioned during the podcast, is it going to be at Whole Foods nationally soon? Because I've been looking for it. So I just happen to have one right here. This is one of them. This is the oat and walnut. Yeah. Yeah, no. Yeah, Rich, we launched them nationally at Whole Food Market stores as of about two weeks ago. And they should be 25% off for a little bit longer. Nice. They weren't there yet when I checked a couple weeks ago, but maybe it was the day I went. Yeah, they were all going into Whole Foods between March. I'm sorry, where are we now? Between February 16th and March 2nd. So they should be there. Nice. I can't wait to try it. Ever since you described it, a lot of these plant milks have oil in them. Yeah, I'm really looking forward to trying it. Oils, emulsifiers, phosphates, refined sugars. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. What's that? Yeah. Yeah, so that's breakfast. Yeah, so for lunch, it's always the big salad.
[41:06] Walk me through that big salad so I know exactly how I can make it for myself today. Sure, sure. Always has to have kale in it. I had arugula. No, but hold on. You got to give me more details than that. Is it curly kale? Is it Russian kale? Is it dinosaur kale? What kind of kale? Actually, to be honest, I think it's curly kale, but it's a big bag of organic kale that I buy from the supermarket. Okay, okay. But I do buy fresh curly kale, too, and other kinds. The purple kale, I've seen in the stores, I buy that. But usually it's this big bag of kale, organic. I also buy arugula in a package. package um i always add tomatoes uh onions everything in the g-bombs um now hold on you're you're dropping words that people that may not be right a lot of people are not g-bombs yeah so yeah what are g-bombs yep the greens the beans i always said my favorite is black beans i'll add on top yeah um onions uh i'll use scallions too sometimes i also use garlic i love garlic, mushrooms i eat a variety of mushrooms uh recently i started with um lion's mane.
[42:29] They i i love mushrooms uh oyster mushrooms you name it um so barely mushrooms berries uh Uh, I don't add those to the salads. I add them to the oatmeal and I also snack on berries later on in the day, which we'll find out about. Um, and then the seeds, I love, um, pumpkin seeds. Those are my favorite. The sunflower seeds. Uh, I also, um, add walnuts. Uh, I try not to overdo it with the nuts, but, um, those, those are my favorites. Right. And then what about ground where you said ground flaxseed meal and chia seeds? Yeah. Those, those go in the oatmeal. Okay. All right. So, um, I think so you were in the middle of talking about your salad. Yeah. Yeah. So the salad, what I do is recently I started topping it with this organic horseradish mustard. So I was listening to a podcast about the benefits of horseradish. Wow. I like the taste of it. I discovered that I love spicy foods. I never used to until I became plant-based, but now I love jalapenos, anything spicy.
[43:44] So I add the horseradish mushroom mustard. I don't know why this is tongue twister today. And I also found a vinegar from California, balsamic, that I love called pomegranate balsamic vinegar. It tastes awesome.
[44:05] I also have a new love for cilantro, fresh cilantro. Ever since, because I had mercury fillings in my mouth for years, I decided to have those removed. How long ago? Last year. Yeah. And how was that? Because I've got some in my mouth as well, but I'm thinking about having removed. They make this process sound scary, but actually it wasn't bad. He did it in two different appointments it was uh it was about probably 45 minutes per appointment yeah um so as long as you have the time it wasn't really painful um but i was reading during the time how to detox afterwards and i was eating heavy cilantro and um chlorella and things like that but i i realized that i love cilantro so i kind of stuck stuck with that and i'll add it to a nice smoothie oh and you're dressing so as you're dressing for your salad a combination of the horseradish and the um balsamic vinegar and you mix that together with your salad and how how big is your salad like is it a big bowl it is this huge yeah it's, Yeah, I don't know how many ounces, but it's a big bowl. Right. It's enough for when other people have seen me eat it, they say, how do you eat all that food?
[45:34] And how long does it take you to eat that rich salad?
[45:39] Well, remember, I used to be a binge eater, so not too long, probably 20 minutes, half hour. Right, right. How long does it take you to make it? it um well remember i i batch cook a lot of it so um probably an hour you know every couple days maybe so an hour but then when you spend the hour and that's for how many how many salads like is that for four three three three yeah got it yeah so i mean there's preparation involved but um you You know, I enjoy the preparation because, you know, you enjoy the benefits. Once you get used to this, you know, you feel good.
[46:23] Well, what I'm hearing, what I really like, Rich, and I want you to get to, you know, snacking and dinner, but is that you have a routine that you follow and it sounds like you don't deviate from it. No. And you've been doing something similar, obviously, for eight years and it's worked incredibly well. So I give you huge props and kudos for keeping it simple and being consistent. I think that's the thing. I think that's the key. People think it has to be complicated, but I was never a cook. Although now I think trying some of these recipes, I probably could be, but I was never a cook. I like simple things. Yeah. So what about snacking and dinner? Yeah. Well, I told you about the two apples a day. I love apples. They fill me up when I get hungry. I probably have those, you know, mid-afternoon. Um, if I'm extra hungry, you know, I'll have, um, almond butter, um, no sugar added, uh, no oil. Um, you know, add that on, um, are you familiar with Susie's thin cakes?
[47:32] No, no. It has very few ingredients, has whole grains, um, like 15 milligrams of sodium. So it's almost nothing of sodium. Uh, so really it's basically just the grains and I'll add the almond butter to that. Um sometimes if i'm extra hungry um i'll make a smoothie if i'm working out uh you know i want something right after uh my smoothies i typically add more kale um cilantro that i told you about i'll add maybe some fennel celery.
[48:09] Um trying to think what else um banana or berries uh yeah um just just whatever i have around basically uh veggies that i'll add to it okay and and dinner um maybe i'll make some steamed veggies if i have time or microwave some um organic frozen um uh broccoli or cauliflower flour um sweet potatoes i love um purple sweet potatoes that's my favorite uh another favorite is japanese sweet potatoes i have uh sweet potatoes every night uh for dinner wow well we we had some last night um how do you have them just eat them plain or you top them with something uh just plain you know i find you don't even need it i mean i use a lot of spices so i shouldn't say plain. I mean, I don't use dressing, but I use a ton of spices.
[49:08] You know, I love cardamom. You know, I use turmeric, coriander.
[49:17] Uh well just quite a few of them yeah well uh so for those that are listening you have a a blog, and i i noticed you have a blog post uh that's all about how to ditch the salt yeah you and you refer to these these spices and how they can take the place of salt so when you say you know you're you've ditched the salt how adamant are you about removing salt from your from it has to be very Very, very low sodium if I eat it. Like I mentioned, the thin cakes, it has to be less than 100, ideally less than 50. But I really avoid processed foods. So whatever's in the food is what I get. So I'm sure I'm probably getting 1,500, you know, with all the food that I eat.
[50:07] Oh, I bet you it's less than that, Rich. It could be. It could be if all you're if really you're not eating anything from a package box or can from the most part. And you're doing your okra, your berries, your seeds, your salads and then your veggies and your sweet potatoes at night and then your smoothie. And you're I mean, I bet you you're lucky if you're getting 750 milligrams of sodium over the course. It could be. It could be. And I do notice I really am sensitive to sodium and blood pressure. For those who think that I cured the problem, I've had food that I could tell was very salty. And I checked my blood pressure over the week after that, over the few times this happened. And my blood pressure stays elevated for a while after the sodium. It really does make a difference. Yeah.
[51:01] Now, you mentioned earlier when we were talking about your mother and your father, how your father has this giant cell, arteritis, but your mother, it sounds like she was going down a pretty unhealthy path, and she has followed your lead. Is that correct? Yeah, I'm glad you brought that up because I'm so proud of her. She was open to this plant-based way of eating because she saw the results I had. And, you know, as I mentioned earlier, she's the type who, you know, no big deal, just take a med for it. Yeah. And so this was a complete reversal of her attitude. So she fully embraced the plant-based eating.
[51:48] You know, I don't think she's had meat for a couple of years now. And her diabetes is completely gone. This is somebody who was on meds for 40 plus years.
[51:59] For diabetes? Yeah. Type two diabetes. And was she overweight? She was. She was probably she she wasn't religious about weighing herself either. But I think when she was at the doctor, she was probably 220 or so. And she's short. She's five one or so. Right. So that was heavy for her. And now she's probably 130. Wow. And what is she still a nurse? Well, she retired recently. I'm proud to say she worked until her 70s, her early 70s, but she recently retired.
[52:38] But, yeah, I mean, she did after all those years. What did all the other nurses think of her transition? Well, she wasn't open about it to them. I wish she was, but she's not open about sharing her story with people. I mean, she probably is more now, but, you know, she's not into it. Bragging i guess well i wish she would though but weren't weren't the other her the other nurses asking her oh yeah they did they did ask about her diet yeah yeah and she she was like how i was back before i went vegan you know i shied away from saying i was uh vegan before me and robert cheek so she she would just basically say she added more veggies and fruit right right right just Just eating more of the veggies and fruit. Yeah, exactly.
[53:32] They know it works after seeing her, of course. Okay, so that's fantastic. And so it sounds like your parents are no longer together. No. What about your father? He's seeing your results. Does he have any interest? No, none at all. And it kills me because I know it would help him, even if it doesn't reverse some of his conditions. I mean, to have to take sleeping pills and have the sleeping pills not work anymore and constipation and all these issues that he's complained about over the years.
[54:04] You know, I would say, well, I think more fiber would help you with certain problems. And, you know, this might help you for sleeping. And I tried to give him advice over the years. One thing I'll say that he has done, though, is at least he'll try to eat more of these foods, but he's still on when we eat the junk food he still goes to mcdonald's and he still has these problems but um you know at least he recognized my success he he thinks he's too old to change um but even though there's other even even though my mom changed he's still not open you how old's your dad he just turned 80 he's quite a bit older than my mom right so you should remind him of the story of my father and his heart and my dad's heart disease patients he had one gentleman that came to him let's just say his name was ed yeah and and ed at the eight came to him at the age of 86 with severe heart disease and people that are um followers of the podcast have heard this story, but Ed just called my parents a couple of weeks ago to let them know what he was serving at his 102nd birthday party. Oh my God. Wow. Incredible story.
[55:29] Yeah. So it's never too late. And your dad at 80 is still a pup. He really is.
[55:37] I know there's some incredible stories out there. I think maybe if the more he eats these foods, because he realizes the food tastes good now.
[55:47] Maybe if he increases the amount he eats, you know, maybe gradually he'll do it. But unfortunately, you know, he got remarried and my stepmom is the same way as him. And the two of them kind of feed off each other and eat these bad foods. So, yeah. Yeah. Well, she she recently found out she's pre-diabetic. She has to watch herself. Yeah. Well, they are like so many other Americans are caught in the pleasure trap. Yeah. Doug, Doug Lyle's pleasure trap. And and gosh, Gosh, who's a co-author with Doug? It's Goldman. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[56:35] Let me ask, what would you tell someone that's out there that thinks that they can't do what you've done? They just don't have it. What advice would you give to somebody that thinks they can't do it? I love that question because I think anybody can do this. It's really about the mindset. that you have to tell your well you can't really think of the the whole picture especially when you're over 350 pounds like i was if i had thought that i have to lose 150 pounds back then that would have been too discouraging for me i don't think i ever would have did it.
[57:14] But i think what did it for me was um learning about health along the way but if you just um You know, take it slow. Maybe do a challenge like the 13-week challenge I did with Robert Cheek's journal. Not look at the whole picture. I think after this short amount of time, it's easier to stick with. You'll realize how good you feel. The numbers will improve. And I don't think you'll want to go back to it. But Dr. Bernard even says, I think it's three weeks. Right. He wants people to try the plan. And normally, they don't want to go back to their old ways. So that's the important thing is to not look at the whole picture right away. Yeah. I mean, we've even got a seven-day challenge, right? It's incredible what can happen in just seven days. Absolutely. Absolutely. So, Rich, looking back over the last, let's just say since 2012, when you really decided you were going to make a U-turn. concern yeah on your health what was the hardest what's been the hardest thing.
[58:19] Honestly, I think giving up foods like cheese at first. You know, the cravings are real for the first few weeks. But another challenge besides the food was just getting used to the comments. That first year, I was not used to getting attention. And all these people were coming up to me saying, oh, my God, look how much weight you lost. And I would downplay it. and that was really hard for me and I never thought I'd be doing what I'm doing now um you know in college I was um considered an introvert that's what my professor said and and here I am today um I want to share my story I um I wrote a book uh yeah I want people to get the message.
[59:10] And I think this lifestyle woke up, you know, something within me that just, I found this important to share to people. So I never would have discovered that if it wasn't for, you know, when I went through. Well, you know what, again, I want to give you huge props for, as an introvert, it sounds like you had to get out of your comfort zone in a big way. Oh, I did. Yeah. Yeah. And because there's probably untold numbers of people, that are going to hear your story, know of your story, that can identify with you and are going to be inspired to follow your lead. So thanks for that. What exactly is the name of your book? And when did you- Plant-Based Journey to Health. Plant-Based Journey to Health. And when did that come out? December of 2020. I made a promise to myself that I would finish it during the pandemic because I I didn't have to do my long commute to work. You know, the offices were shut down. So it gave me some extra time. And I wanted to do it for a couple years before that. And I made it happen that year. Got it.
[1:00:27] Rich, are you single? Are you married? What's your status? Single, maybe eventually get married.
[1:00:34] Yeah, just enjoying the single life, I guess. Got it. Got it. Well, I'm sure there's a lot of single, whole food, plant-based women. That would love to hang out with you rich yeah yeah that what's your day job these days i'm a webmaster i work for a local community college uh we're in we're we were in the middle of a merge so it's kind of a busy time we were 12 smaller community colleges now we're the largest community college in um the east coast wow so it keeps me busy and i'm also um I got my coaching certificate recently from Dr. Furman, and I started a new plant-based coaching initiative with three plant-based friends because I really want to give back to the community. I realize that, you know, as much as I like my job, my day job, there's something within me that just wants to give back. I want to see people get healthy, and I think I could make an impression on people who are interested in trying it out.
[1:01:48] I think that people's health is their number one asset. It is. It is. Absolutely. And if you can help people regain their lost health,
[1:02:00] that sounds like something that's very exciting. Where can people go to learn more about your coaching program? PlantBaseCoaches.net. I was going to say .com. I tried to buy .com, but the person who owns it wasn't interested in selling. Got it. Dot net. Right. Well, hey, Rich, this has been terrific. It's good to see you again after seeing you in New York, you know, God, nine, ten months ago. That was a great time, too. Yeah, it was. It was. But your rags to riches health story is something else. And I want to thank you for coming on the PLANTSTRONG podcast, sharing how you did it, why you did it. And for continuing to inspire people beyond your circle. So thank you. No problem. I was happy to be here. Yeah. Hey, will you give me a virtual fist bump on the way out here? Definitely. All right. Ready? One, two, three. PLANTSTRONG
[1:03:08] Richard wrote a book about his journey called A Plant-Based Journey to Health, From Morbidly Obese to Plant-Based Athlete. And I'll be sure to link to that in today's show notes. I'll also link to his blog and social media channels so that you can continue to follow Richard's success. He had such great advice for each of us today.
[1:03:32] Find the foods that you like to eat. Make repeatable steps every single day. And always, always keep it PLANTSTRONG. Thank you so much for listening. And we'll see you next week. The PlantStrong Podcast team includes Carrie Barrett, Laurie Kortowich, and Ami Mackey. If you like what you hear, do us a favor and share the show with your friends and loved ones. You can always leave a five-star rating and review on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. And while you're there, make sure to hit that follow button so that you never miss an episode. As always, this and every episode is dedicated to my parents, Dr. Caldwell B. Esselstyn Jr. And Anne Crile Esselstyn.
