#70: Dr. Irminne Van Dyken - What do Nitric Oxide, Sulforaphane, and Humming All Have in Common?
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken
What do nitric oxide, turmeric, sulforaphane, and humming all have in common? Your health and longevity, of course!
You’re going to be humming with joy after you listen to this episode today with Dr. Irminne Van Dyken. Dr. Van Dyken is a general surgeon based in Hawaii, and she is also a cutting-edge researcher and plant-based advocate who teaches others how to optimize their own health and microbiome through diet and lifestyle.
Get ready to have fun and think a little outside the box because this interview is packed with quick hits on topics that she is most excited about these days.
If you enjoyed Episode 5 with Doug Evans on sprouting a couple of weeks ago, you’ll definitely love our continued talk around this new word - Sulforaphane. It seems to be everywhere these days! What is it, what are the benefits, and where can I get it?
Dr. Van Dyken also shares her expertise on the importance of nitric oxide and why it’s a good thing that our tongues are textured like a shag carpet! And speaking of tongues, she also discusses the health benefits of humming...yes...humming for health! So simple, right?
Finally, she touches on her favorite spices: curcumin and turmeric - and the vast health benefits of each.
This is a jam-packed episode of helpful advice from one of our favorite doctors. Dr. Iminne Van Dyken may have gotten into surgery to fix things, but as you’ll hear, she’s more interested in helping you achieve optimal health long before you ever need to go under the knife!
Episode and PLANTSTRONG Resources:
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Order Your Chef's Garden "Repair and Rescue Leafy Green Box"
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Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
For me, I went into surgery because I like to fix stuff. I like things getting better. And all of a sudden, I saw you can fix stuff before the patient even gets to me many times, or sometimes when they get to me. So to me, that kind of was the impetus for really studying alternative lifestyle medicine and other ways besides surgery and medication for people to regain their health
Rip Esselstyn:
Season three of the Plant-Strong podcast explores those Galileo moments where you seek to understand the real truth around your health, and dare to see the world through a different lens. This season, we honor those courageous seekers who are paving the way for you and me. So grab your telescope, pointed towards your future, and let's get plant-strong together.
Rip Esselstyn:
I have some fun things to update you on this week. First, earlier this year, we launched a special promotion and we've been surprised at how much you've enjoyed it. For the first time, we offered a 14-day free trial to our Plant-Strong meal planner so that you can come in and really kick the tires before deciding if it's right for you. We've extended this promotion so more of you can take advantage. Visit mealplanner.plantstrong.com and enter the code STARTFRESH, to redeem your two-week trial. Come, check out our database filled with hundreds of recipes, see instructional cooking videos, make and save personal menus, and shop using our adaptive grocery list. You can even upload and save your own recipes, so this meal planner becomes your wingman or wingwoman, whatever the case may be in the kitchen, saving you loads of time and ensuring you use up all those vegetables.
Rip Esselstyn:
Again, free trial for the first time and for a limited time, go to the show notes or visit mealplanner.plantstrong.com and enter the code STARTFRESH. Yes, you have to enter a credit card, but you won't be charged if you cancel before the trial ends and that's a click of a button. Enjoy the test drive and let's get cooking.
Rip Esselstyn:
One other item to announce today, we have fell in love, hard with the Chef's Garden so much so, that we've partnered with them to launch an exclusive repair and rescue leafy green box that is packed with the freshest assortment of gourmet greens shipped straight to your door. Their team of researchers have tested the nitrate levels of their harvest and together, we selected the best of the best for you to really increase your nitric oxide levels. My father would be so proud of you. If you want to learn more about nitric oxide, be sure to check out season two's interview with Dr. Nathan Bryant.
Rip Esselstyn:
Anyways, if you want those six servings a day, shipped straight to your door each week, visit planstrong.com/garden for details. We're definitely looking forward to our mystery Valentine's dinner this weekend with our friends from the Chef's Garden. Thank you for joining us in this beautiful nourishing feast. We can't wait to cook with you. If for some reason you missed out on this promotion, don't worry about it. No doubt we'll be doing more of these special dinners very soon, so just stay tuned.
Rip Esselstyn:
We at Plant Strong have really fallen in love with learning about the benefits of microgreens and sharing them with all of you, not only in this special event, but also here on the podcast. And speaking of microgreens, you're going to be humming with joy after you listened to my guest today, Dr. Irminne Van Dyken. I first met Dr. Van Dyken when she spoke at Plant-Stock, back in 2017. She was spectacular, stole the stage. She's a general surgeon based in Hawaii, and she is also a researcher and a plant-based advocate who teaches others how to optimize their own health and their microbiome through diet and lifestyle. Today, we've got some tasty bites and quick hits on topics that she is most excited about these days, that I'm sure will get you jazzed as well.
Rip Esselstyn:
If you enjoyed my conversation with Doug Evans on sprouting a couple of weeks ago, you'll definitely love our continued talk around this new word that is buzzing everywhere, sulforaphane. It's created when you combine the two substances glucoraphanin and myrosinase, and those are some hairy tongue twisters.
Rip Esselstyn:
Anyway, sulforaphane, it seems to be everywhere. What is it, what are the benefits, and where can I get it? Stay tuned, you're going to find out. Dr. Van Dyken also shares her expertise on the importance of nitric oxide and why it's a good thing our tongues are textured like a shag carpet. And speaking of tongues, she also discusses the health benefits of humming, yes humming, for health. So simple, so powerful. Finally, she touches on her favorite spices, curcumin and turmeric, and the vast health benefits of each. This is a jam-packed episode of helpful advice from one of our favorite doctors. Dr. Irminne Van Dyken may have gotten into surgery to fix things, but as you're going to hear, she's more interested in helping you achieve optimal health long before you need to go under the knife. That deserves a big kale yeah.
Rip Esselstyn:
This season, we are really focusing in on courageous, truth seekers that are really paving the way for everybody else. You are absolutely epitomizing that. Can you just let our audience know a little bit about your background. I know that you're a surgeon, but why this love affair with kind of lifestyle medicine? How did that happen?
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
Yeah. I am a general surgeon and I realized pretty quickly that probably the majority of my patients, they come in and they have conditions that are preventable or treated with lifestyle medicine. So with huge changes, people can reclaim their health. And for me, I went into surgery because I like to fix stuff. I like things getting better. All of a sudden, I saw you can fix stuff before the patient even gets to me many times, or sometimes when they get to me. So to me, that that kind of was the impetus for really studying alternative lifestyle medicine and other ways besides surgery and medication for people to regain their health.
Rip Esselstyn:
How long have you been passionate and nose down into this kind of lifestyle?
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
For me personally, I've been vegetarian since I was very young, nine years old, and I continued to eat dairy eggs until I was an intern in residency, so that was 10, almost 11 years ago now. And at that point in time, my husband and I, Russell and I decided to go cold-turkey and we went completely plant-based. Since then, I saw the changes in myself, I saw the changes in Russell, I saw the changes in his family and my family. It really was kind of an accidental finding. And at that time, I mean, in 2010, it was pretty new on the scene, the literature and the studies showing that being plant-based was helpful. So I started diving into the literature and I realized, "Oh my gosh, there is so much here, and there is so many things I can encourage my patients to adopt and help them out with," so I dive head in.
Rip Esselstyn:
So you mentioned that you and Russell noticed some changes. What were some changes you noticed?
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
Well, we both lost weight. I was training in North Dakota, so North Dakota winters are long and cold and I was a little chunky. So we lost weight very much. What else? More energy. I mean, I was an intern. I was working 30 hour days, tons of coffee. I had to have my bagel with cheese and an egg on it every morning, otherwise I wouldn't survive. Well, once the plant-based transition happened, I had so much energy, it was incredible. I didn't need coffee anymore. I didn't need any of the foods, whatever, it was a huge drastic change for me.
Rip Esselstyn:
I'd love to dive into some of the things that you really kind of know very deeply. One of the things that we have going on is COVID-19, and it seems like it's kind of gathering steam and not everybody's going to have access to vaccines here in the next couple months. I saw that you are a big fan of nitric oxide.
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
Absolutely.
Rip Esselstyn:
Therapeutically, and otherwise, but can you talk a little bit about maybe nitric oxide and what we can do to enhance our own nitric oxide production?
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
For sure. Thanks for bringing that up. Nitric oxide to me is just an incredible little molecule. I first got tipped off to this probably about a year and a half ago. I saw some papers about nitric oxide and the typical thing, nitric oxide, you think it's a small little gas, it's just a nitrogen and an oxygen molecule. It was first discovered in the 1700s, and we just thought it was a air pollutant type of thing. And it wasn't until the 1970s that we really realized how it was good for our health. There were a few scientists and three of them actually won the Nobel Prize in Medicine and Science for this, just for figuring out the connection between nitric oxide and cardiovascular health or heart health.
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
Nitric oxide, we know is what we call a vasodilator. It makes our arteries and our veins dilate up so we can accommodate more blood flow, we can get more oxygen where it needs to go. Nitric oxide in that regard is super important. Now, if you think about nitric oxide, how do we get nitric oxide? Nitric oxide is super interesting. It's half-life, so how long it is actually active, it's less than half a second. So it's there and it's gone super fast, right? It's really surprising that it was discovered in the first place, with such a short half-life.
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
But in any case, so in our bodies, nitric oxide is actually produced, or we get it two ways. So one is an enzymatic reaction in our body. It's via an enzyme called L-arginine and it actually gets metabolized or oxidized into nitric oxide by a nitric oxide synthase. And this is an important reaction. This is the reaction that helps our blood vessels dilate. This is the reaction that the drug Viagra targets, for men. It helps dilate that pathway.
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
The second one is getting nitrates from food. So we can get high nitrate foods, things like green leafy vegetables, et cetera, they can get into our bloodstream and they can get metabolized into nitric oxide. All of that, super good for health. The second pathway is super interesting because it intersects with another one of my loves, which is the microbiome. So the nitric oxide can not be produced unless we have certain bacteria that live inside all the little crips and folds in our tongue. So our tongue is like a shag carpet, up and down and there's all these little canyons and valleys. There's bacteria that live in there that create the nitric oxide from the nitrates that we eat.
Rip Esselstyn:
Is this this a species of bacteria that lives just there?
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
Yeah. It just lives in our tongue. It's specific to our tongue. That is the other way we get nitric oxide. Now, as we age, we lose that first pathway. We lose that pathway, the one that Viagra targets, because we don't have that enzyme anymore, it becomes dysfunctional. So as we age, it becomes more and more important to get it by the second pathway, via our microbiome, via other things. That's the nitric oxide connection.
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
When we talk about the nitric oxide and health, so we know about vascular health. We know it's super important for our blood vessels for our overall cardiovascular health. What's interesting is that recently nitric oxide has been shown to be active in a test tube against COVID-19. The SARS coV-2 virus, the virus that causes this pandemic, they have shown that nitric oxide treatment kills over 99% of the virus.
Rip Esselstyn:
Wow.
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
That's super exciting. Yeah. If you think about it, there's trials ongoing, level three trials in the FDA, these are big trials where they're studying inhaled nitric oxide gas to treat COVID-19 or to prevent it. There's over 36 studies right now that are ongoing. One of them, for example, is in healthcare workers in Boston. And basically right before they start their shift, they inhale nitric oxide gas. After their shift, they inhale it again, and they're seeing whether it prevents COVID-19. Fascinating stuff.
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
If we can get nitric oxide levels high in our sinuses, in our airways, in our lungs, we could potentially prevent COVID-19. That's huge. Now, I'm not saying we should not do any other traditional treatments for COVID-19, we should not go to the hospital if we're sick, that type of thing. But if we can add this on, something that potentially is completely free, which I'll get to in a minute, that could be huge for overall health and preventing getting sick.
Rip Esselstyn:
Huge.
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
Huge.
Rip Esselstyn:
Now, what can we do? Is there something we can do, I think it's called nasal nitric oxide?
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
Yeah. So that is something, again, that's really fascinating. We know that nitric oxide, we can increase our nitric concentrations a couple of ways, just depending on how we breathe. The lowest nitric oxide concentration would be just breathing in and out through your mouth, just normal breathing, talking. If we just switch, breathe in and out of our nose, or in our nose and out our mouth, even we're going to get higher nitric oxide concentrations in our airways. But beyond this, if we add humming, a specific type of humming, if we can that, we can increase the nitric oxide content in our nasal passages, et cetera, big time. We can increase it basically to the same amount that the inhaled nitric oxide gas trials that they're doing right now in these healthcare workers. It's pretty fantastic.
Rip Esselstyn:
So humming, how often, how long, and what's a good tune that you suggest we hum?
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
That's a good, good question. And we don't really know that. We don't have huge studies on that. Studies do show that 300 Hertz is the optimal humming. And I don't know if you know what 300 Hertz is. I sure don't, but it's usually, they say it's the C3 key on a piano, so I'm thinking like, "mmmmm", like a doe, really nice and low. And you can actually go onto YouTube and just type in the search bar 300 Hertz, and you'll get a few videos that come up with that exact tone so you can match it. We know that that is the one that causes the reverberations in the sinus to be just the right frequency to increase nitric oxide, so that's the one you want to do.
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
As far as how long, we don't know, we have no idea. The trials with the healthcare workers in Boston, they're using 20 minutes, twice a day. So if we could potentially increase our nitric oxide concentrations to that and do 20 minutes twice a day, I feel like that would be adequate, but again, we don't have science on this. It's all brand new.
Rip Esselstyn:
Well, so maybe either when we're in a bath or a shower, or maybe driving, commuting, good time to-
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
No, no.
Rip Esselstyn:
No?
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
No. Driving is a big no-no.
Rip Esselstyn:
Driving and humming is a big no-no? Or driving period?
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
Yes. Thank you for bringing that up, driving and humming.
Rip Esselstyn:
Why?
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
Well, one of the biggest side effects is lightheadedness. So if you think about, if you're humming and you're driving and you pass out, that could be really bad. So don't do that.
Rip Esselstyn:
Oh, well it'd probably be worse than the bathtub then.
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
I suppose. As long as you're okay, yeah. Yo got to be in a safe place, maybe [crosstalk 00:16:55] room or something.
Rip Esselstyn:
You need to have a lifeguard on duty if you're doing it in the bathtub.
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
Absolutely. Absolutely.
Rip Esselstyn:
Well, okay, that's good. Well, I'm going to start humming, not while I drive home from the office here.
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
It's actually quite fun though. It really is. Since I've started doing it and I've been doing it for quite a few months now, you feel good. It's almost like a little bit of a high when you're done humming. I don't know, you feel really good.
Rip Esselstyn:
I like it.
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
And if you have time for an anecdotal story, so there's a one case report. There was a gentleman and this was pre pandemic, pre everything, he had read that nitric oxide was antibacterial, antiviral. He suffered from chronic rhinosinusitis, which is chronic sinus infections. He just decided, he was in his sixties, he said, "You know what, I'm just going to try this and see. What do I have to lose?" And he hummed, he hummed a lot. He hummed an hour, twice a day. He was very dedicated. After four days though, he had complete resolution of his symptoms. All his symptoms were gone. And the other thing was that he suffered from PACs, which is an irregular heartbeat. A lot of people suffer from this, and it's scary when your heart starts beating out of whack. He noticed that when he did this, his heart, actually those rhythms stopped. So his heart was in a regular rhythm and it was just a side thing that he noticed. Granted, that was one guy, one case report, but it was a super interesting story.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yeah. That is super interesting. So all the listeners out there start humming and then write to us and let us know anecdotally, all the benefits that getting from it.
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
Yes, so we want to know. But don't hum while you're doing something important.
Rip Esselstyn:
Let me ask you about this because when I reached out to you to be on the Plant-Strong podcast, you mentioned that one of the things you were super excited about right now was sulforaphane, if I'm pronouncing it correctly.
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
Yes, you are.
Rip Esselstyn:
And it's crazy, since I reached out to you just a couple of weeks ago, how I've heard about it, seen it everywhere. But you mentioned that you're so excited about it, you're probably going to write a book, which is like, "Hooray, Go, go, go, go." But for our listeners, what is self sulforaphane and why should we be excited about it?
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
I'd love to tell you. Sulforaphane, first off, is one of three of my favorite things right now. Sulforaphane is number one, curcumin and turmeric is number two, and then the number three is the microbiome. Sulforaphane also really intersects with the microbiome, which is really, really cool. Sulforaphane is a chemical. It's a chemical that we recently realized was good for us. It comes from cruciferous vegetables, but mostly broccoli. Your mom was right when she said, "Eat your broccoli." That's something that is really good for you.
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
What happens is, sulforaphane is an endproduct chemical basically. When you have a broccoli stem or however you're going to eat it, you actually have all these little packaged pre-products that are in the broccoli leaf for the sprout or whatever you're eating. Now, when you are going to chew it, or when you blended, or something like that, the two precursors mix. Sorry, I'm getting a little science-y on you, but it will be quick. The two precursors are glucosinolate and myrosinase. Glucosinolate and myrosinase have to combine to create a reaction to get sulforaphane. You can do that by chewing your broccoli, but the myrosinase is a very unstable enzyme. It lasts super, super short.
Rip Esselstyn:
Shorter than NO?
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
No, actually not. A good question. No. It actually lasts a little longer than that, but that is the unpredictable part. So when you want to maximize your Sulforaphane, which you definitely want to do, you need to make sure you get enough myrosinase. Sometimes it's not present in the broccoli that you have or the broccoli sprouts, et cetera, so you have to figure out ways to get it more active. You can do things like add exogenous or other sources of myrosinase, like from daikon, from wasabi, from mustard, and that'll get it activated.
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
Why do I care so much about sulforaphane? It's been shown to do so many incredible things. First off, for people who have diabetes and have issues controlling their blood sugar, it actually helps control the blood sugar. There's some really good studies showing that it minimizes symptoms in people who have autism or autism spectrum disorders. It has been shown to be active against H pylori, which is a bacteria that causes stomach ulcers and that type of thing. There are ongoing studies right now that are looking at it treating cognitive decline, so memory loss as we age and Alzheimer's disease. Skin health, it's actually been shown to decrease UV-associated cancer formation in your skin, which is huge, and then anti-aging it overall.
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
Then the other really big thing that I find is so awesome is it can be anti-pollution. They did a study in China where they showed that people who are subject to like diesel fumes and air pollution, and then they took a broccoli sprout beverage extract, they actually excreted this pollution in their urine, so that didn't stay in their bodies. They actually were able to get rid of it, which is amazing to me. As far as I know, there's no drug that can do that.
Rip Esselstyn:
Right. So it was able to pull it out.
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
Exactly. Exactly. The sulforaphane is something that I think it's a new kid on the block, as far as how many people are figuring out how amazing it is and how incredible it is, and there's more studies to come. There are so many ongoing studies and unfortunately, quite a few of them are slowed down because of the pandemic, but they are registered and they're ongoing, and hopefully we'll get really good results.
Rip Esselstyn:
And so is the only way to get sulforaphane from cruciferous green, leafy vegetables?
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
Yes, yes. It's actually a misconception that all green leafy vegetables or crucifers have sulforaphane. Broccoli is the one that has the highest sulforaphane. Kale, for example, kale is a super healthy for you, but it doesn't have any sulforaphane. The broccoli is where you want to be for this. And not only broccoli, but broccoli sprouts. I. you have not been into sprouting, I suggest you start, it's a little tricky to get started, but the broccoli sprouts, so two to three-day-old broccoli sprouts have the highest concentration of sulforaphane. No need to go buy an expensive supplement, no need to pay a whole bunch of money for a stabilized sulforaphane pill. You can get it from broccoli sprouts.
Rip Esselstyn:
Wow. What do you recommend, how much and how often?
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
The sulforaphane, in order to get it from broccoli sprouts, it's hard because it's a variable thing, we can't predict. Not only is every broccoli cultivar going to be a little different in levels, but also us, how we have that myrosinase is going to vary. The myrosinase, the part I didn't mention yet and where this intersects with the microbiome is that. Myrosinase can be produced by our gut bacteria. That really unstable enzyme, if we have the right gut bacteria as we digest this broccoli, they will break it down and get us sulforaphane, which is pretty cool. But that makes it hard because everybody's microbiome is a little different, right?
Rip Esselstyn:
Right.
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
We don't know who has the bacteria that can digest it or not. But that being said, most studies will show that about a third of a cup broccoli sprouts is enough to get the benefits from sulforaphane.
Rip Esselstyn:
Is it safe to say that if you are a predominantly whole food, plant-based eater, that you have the bacteria in your gut to produce the...
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
Good question. Honestly, those studies have not been done. We don't know what type of eater you have to be to have the bacteria that digest it. But that being said, we know that people who eat a lot of fiber, eat a plant-based diet, those are the ones that are going to have the most diverse microbiome, so theoretically yeah, we should be at an advantage.
Rip Esselstyn:
Right. Okay. So the more diverse the gut bacteria, the better off.
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
Yes, absolutely.
Rip Esselstyn:
Right. So you mentioned on your list, the three things you're most excited about. Number one, we just talked about, sulforaphane. What was number two, can you remember? I can.
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
Curcumin.
Rip Esselstyn:
That's right, so curcumin/turmeric, right?
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
Yes.
Rip Esselstyn:
Why are you so jazzed about that?
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
Curcumin and sulforaphane both are powerful, powerful anti-inflammatories. There is an anti-inflammatory pathway called the NRF-2 pathway and curcumin and sulforaphane are the molecules that can activate that antiinflammatory pathway the most. That's why I like it.
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
The difference between curcumin and sulforaphane is curcumin, it doesn't have good bioavailability, meaning it's really hard for us to make that curcumin molecule beneficial and available for us to use. Sulforaphane on the other hand, it has over 80% bioavailability, so what we eat, we're going to get the benefit from for sure. Now, the exciting thing about curcumin is there's a lot of new formulations coming out, and these are more on the supplement end of things, but they are what we call phytosomal curcumin, so a curcumin that is formulated with say, a soy fat, for example, that helps us absorb it better.
Rip Esselstyn:
What's turmeric's relationship to curcumin?
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
So turmeric is the food, the root, and it is a healthy part of anybody's diet. Turmeric contains curcumin. So the curcumin is kind of an extract of the turmeric, so to speak. Now, you could eat a whole bunch of turmeric, but again, you got to kind of figure out the bioavailability and how much you're absorbing from each turmeric root that you're eating, et cetera.
Rip Esselstyn:
You mentioned, I think that they have a supplement, you said, with the curcumin.
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
Mm-hmm (affirmative).
Rip Esselstyn:
It's out there. I actually just yesterday got an advertisement for some sort of sulforaphane supplement that they say it... Do you have any thoughts on supplementation with that stuff? Or is it broccoli sprouts all the way?
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
So, no. Supplementation, it's kind of the Wild Wild West. It's not regulated, so you need to somehow have a way to assure a quality. There are good brands of sulforaphane supplements out there. The question is, I don't know which brand contacted you, et cetera, but you want to make sure that there's reliable people behind it, good medical advisors, they're doing research on that supplement itself. So there are a few supplements that are the ones that have been used in a lot of these studies with sulforaphane. Those are the ones that have shown a difference. Those are the ones I know work. The other ones, if there's no research, how do we know? How do we know that this is going to be the same as the others? Supplements are a pretty hairy thing and they can also be expensive. You can spend a fortune on supplements and maybe not even get much as far as benefits.
Rip Esselstyn:
I've never really promoted supplements, obvious, except for B12, and if you have a deficiency with some of the other things, whether it's D, or iron or something like that. But I just found it kind of wild that sulforaphane has, like I said, just recently appeared on my radar and now I'm hearing about some supplements, and broccoli sprouts, and how broccoli sprouts are 10 times more effective than the broccoli, as far as the amount of sulforaphane in there.
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
That's right.
Rip Esselstyn:
I mean, it's like, "Wow, this is some intense stuff."
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
It is, for sure. And the beautiful thing is you don't have to supplement to get it. If you are on a budget, broccoli seeds are very cheap. You can get a pound of it for, I think, $17 on Amazon, organic seeds. You can sprout them, and one teaspoon of broccoli seeds will make you about a cup and a half of sprouts.
Rip Esselstyn:
What are you sprouting at home these days?
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
Just broccoli.
Rip Esselstyn:
That's it? No lentil sprouts or alfalfa spouts?
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
No, just broccoli, just because I know that it's such a powerful thing. But the one thing, while we talk about sprouting, sprouting does get a bad rap because there's concerns about contamination. Sprouts, it's a wet thing, it's warm, you can get bacterial contamination and possibly even food poisoning. When you sprout, you just need to be super meticulous. You want to make sure that the jar that you're sprouting in or whatever you're using is clean and there's not bacteria sitting all over it and that type of thing. You want to make sure you rinse it. A minimum twice a day, you want to rinse your sprouts until they're ready to go. And then once they're ready, just storm in the fridge. I wouldn't leave them out in the sprouting cover or counter. You want to get them in the fridge.
Rip Esselstyn:
The third thing you're super jazzed about right now, do you want to mention the microbiome or anything about that?
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
What would you like to know about it?
Rip Esselstyn:
Where to start.
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
I mean, it's such a broad topic, but I'm sure your listeners, they're pretty well versed on the microbiome?
Rip Esselstyn:
I think that they probably are, but are there one or two key takeaways you'd like to share with them?
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
Sure. Key takeaway number one, the microbiome is better when it's diverse. You really want a diverse microbiome. How do you do that? You eat fiber. Fiber is where it's at. So 97% of Americans don't get enough fiber. That number staggers me every time I think of it.
Rip Esselstyn:
It's crazy. Can you explain how there's probiotics, and then there's prebiotics, and where does fiber fall in that?
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
Yeah, so there's probiotics and prebiotics, like you said. The probiotics are bacteria, bacteria that you can get from food, say kimchi, sauerkraut, miso, et cetera. You can also take a probiotic supplement. There's so many of them out there. Prebiotics are going to be the thing that feeds the bacteria, the bacteria that we already have in our intestines. That's going to be where fiber falls in. Fiber and certain types of fiber in particular are prebiotics. So a fiber called inulin, for example, that's a very good prebiotic. You can see it in chicory. If your listeners are not turned on to chicory yet, that's also a very fun thing. There's a beverage called Dandy Blend. Have you heard of it?
Rip Esselstyn:
Never.
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
Okay. So it's basically a chicory supplement and dandelion supplement, and it's just a chicory powder, and you add it to hot water and there's no caffeine in it, nothing like that. But you get chicory from it and inulin and it's pretty tasty, so you should check it out.
Rip Esselstyn:
I will check it out. So that was one thing about the microbiome, the diversity. What's the other?
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
Well, there's so much. I'm trying to choose here. Another thing I find really fascinating is the gut bacteria, the bacteria we have in our gut, they dictate so much about us and our overall health. For example, they dictate our cravings. There was a study that showed that gut bacteria that are fed high sugar diet for example, they have this gut-brain connection and they can actually facilitate our cravings for sweet food. It's crazy. We think we're our own little beings, making up our own mind and walking around, and really these bacteria do so much.
Rip Esselstyn:
That is wild to think that we are not in control of our own cravings. It's actually something that lives and potentially breeze inside of it.
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
Right. Definitely.
Rip Esselstyn:
[inaudible 00:33:49].
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
I know. I got another thing too, and I am by no means anti antibiotic. I mean, I use them in my surgeries when it's needed, but there are some studies that show one dose, so one dose of a broad spectrum antibiotic can wipe out a third of your microbiome. Can you imagine? So you have the sniffles or a cold and you go to your doctor and you say, "Really, I need some antibiotics. I feel so bad." You get these antibiotics and you've wiped out a third of your microbiome. I mean, it takes a while to rebuild that. It really does.
Rip Esselstyn:
Do you have any idea how long?
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
No, I don't. And I don't know that that study has been done. I wouldn't venture to guess a few weeks, you can probably start rebuilding that.
Rip Esselstyn:
What I've gathered here and I know this, but you love the science, don't you? You love the date.
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
I do. And that's where I lose people sometimes too, because I'm so into the reactions and this and that. You really got to picture that if you want to understand it.
Rip Esselstyn:
Well, I can appreciate it. My whole growing up, my dad, whenever he was confronted with stuff would be like, "Show me the data. I want to see the data. I want to see the science that supports it."
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
Absolutely. That's the important stuff. I mean, you can't make any conclusions if you don't have good science behind it.
Rip Esselstyn:
Well, this has been fabulous. I'd loved talking about humming, to increase our nasal nitric oxide. And I will not hum on the way home in my car, that would not be safe. And the also, sulforaphane, and curcumin, and turmeric and the microbiome, these are all golden nuggets for the Plant-Strong listeners.
Rip Esselstyn:
Well, let's do our normal sign off. If you could repeat after me, peace.
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
Peace.
Rip Esselstyn:
Turn it around, Engine 2.
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
Engine 2.
Rip Esselstyn:
Keep it Plant-Strong.
Dr. Irminne Van Dyken:
Keep it Plant-Strong.
Rip Esselstyn:
Thank you, Irminne. The world of medicine needs more forward-thinkers and truth seekers like you, who aren't afraid to buck conventional practices and empower patients with confidence and healthy alternatives to achieving the health they deserve. Of all the tips from today, what is one thing that you think you can implement right now? I think it's to get a wide variety of leafy greens on your plates. That's one simple thing that you can do immediately, and we're here to help make it fun, easy, and delicious. Visit plantstrongpodcast.come for more information on this episode and all of our Plant-Strong resources. See you next week.
Rip Esselstyn:
A quick announcement, we still get emails every single day from people wondering where their favorite Engine 2 products are. So I want to let you know what's up because we have not fallen off the face of the planet, far from it. Our team is working hard to relaunch our heritage Engine 2 products that were made and sold by Whole Foods Market, and has our own company now, aptly titled Plantstrong Foods.
Rip Esselstyn:
Currently, you can find the crowd favorites, Rip's Big Bowl, both original and triple berry, the cereals, and our Engine 2 granolas, along with our Plant-Strong pizza kits with oil-free crust and pizza sauces on our website at plantstrongfoods.com. We will be adding more products in the coming months and can't wait to share them with you. As a podcast listener, you can be the first to know that we have four new granola varieties, that will quite simply below your palette. And on deck, soups, chilies and broths. Visit plantstrongfoods.com, and stock your pantry with all the things that will help make the lifestyle delicious and easy.
Rip Esselstyn:
Thank you for listening to the PLANTSTRONG podcast. You can support the show by taking a quick minute to subscribe, rate and review at Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Music, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. Sharing the show with your network is another great way to help us reach as many people as possible with the great news about plants. Thank you in advance for your support. It means everything to me.
Rip Esselstyn:
Have you had your own Galileo moment that you'd like to share? What happened when you stepped into the arena and shed the beliefs that you thought to be true? I'd love to hear it. Visit plantstrongpodcast.com to submit your story and to learn more about today's guests and sponsors.
Rip Esselstyn:
The Plant-Strong podcast team includes Carrie Barrett, Laurie Kortowich, Ami Mackey, Patrick Gavin and Wade Clark. This season is dedicated to all of those courageous truth seekers, who weren't afraid to look through the lens with clear vision and hold firm to a higher truth. Most notably my parents, Dr. Caldwell B. Esselstyn, Jr. And Ann Crile Esselstyn. Thanks for listening.
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