#103: Gene Baur - Aligning Actions with Values
Gene Baur, president and co-founder of Farm Sanctuary
Since 1986, as co-founder and president of Farm Sanctuary, Gene Baur has made it his mission to raise awareness about the abuses of factory farming and the devastation that our agriculture and food system has had on animals, workers, and those of us who consume the food.
It’s not a comfortable topic because no one wants to experience the horrors at these factory farms and slaughterhouses; however, for as driven as he is, you will also never meet someone more gentle, kind, loving and empathetic as Gene.
He is a special soul and has had a hand in providing refuge, care, and healing for thousands of farm animals who otherwise would not have made it. In fact, TIME Magazine has hailed Gene as “the conscience of the food movement” for his 35-years of dedicated service.
Gene is a beacon of light whose purpose is centered on not just providing sanctuary for these animals, but also - without judgement - getting people back in touch with their humanity and aligning their actions with their values.
You'll hear Gene speak about:
The early days of Farm Sanctuary and his rescue missions
Stories about Hilda and other animals who have now become ambassadors for other animals
Why it's so vital to treat these farm animals as friends and not food
The three areas of work for the Sanctuary - Rescue, Education, Advocacy
How you can help support the work of Farm Sanctuary
Today’s conversation is uplifting and heartwarming, as much as it is educational and powerful. Open your hearts to one of the biggest hearts, Gene Baur, Founder of Farm Sanctuary.
About Gene Baur
A pioneer in the field of undercover investigations and farm animal rescue, Gene has visited hundreds of farms, stockyards, and slaughterhouses, documenting the deplorable conditions. His pictures and videos exposing factory farming cruelties have aired nationally and internationally, educating millions about the plight of modern farm animals, and his rescue work inspired an international farm sanctuary movement.
Gene was instrumental in passing the first U.S. laws prohibiting inhumane animal confinement and continues working on systemic food industry reforms. His work has been covered by major media outlets including ABC, NBC, CBS, Fox, the New York Times, LA Times, and Wall Street Journal among others.
Gene Baur has been hailed as “the conscience of the food movement” by Time magazine and named one of Oprah Winfrey’s SuperSoul 100 Givers.
Episode Resources
Farm Sanctuary Website - The Power of Sanctuary
PLANTSTRONGFoods.com - Order our new popcorn and dessert-inspired granolas
Our Virtual PLANTSTOCK Returns September 8-12th - Register today
Full Transcript
Gene Baur:
So many times when I've raised the issue of what happens to animals in the food system, people say, "Don't tell me, I don't want to know." And it's because it is upsetting. So we have to walk, I think, a very delicate balance between creating a situation where people will not put up a wall, but will instead be open to listening and learning and understanding. And that's the one thing that sanctuaries do I believe, is that we create this positive interaction with people and other animals. And when somebody sees an animal who's now been allowed to live, I think it's easier to hear where they came from. And then in that way, you can talk about the abusive system.
Rip Esselstyn:
Season three of the PLANTSTRONG Podcast explores those Galileo moments, where you seek to understand the real truth around your health, and dare to see the world through a different lens. This season, we honor those courageous seekers who are paving the way for you and me. So grab your telescope, point it towards your future, and let's get plantstrong together.
Rip Esselstyn:
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Rip Esselstyn:
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Rip Esselstyn:
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Rip Esselstyn:
Hello, my cruciferous cousins. If you are new to this PLANTSTRONG way of life, or you're just dipping your toes into the exploration, I think you're going to find today's show transformative. I'm Rip Esselstyn, and I want to welcome you to the PLANTSTRONG podcast. Since 1986, this man has made it his mission to raise awareness about the abuses of factory farming, and the devastation that our agriculture and food system has had on animals, workers, and those of us who consume the food. I know it's not a comfortable topic, and none of us want to experience the horrors of these factory farms and slaughterhouses, but here's the thing, for as driven as he is, you will also never meet someone more gentle, kind, loving and empathetic as Gene Baur.
Rip Esselstyn:
He is a special soul. And as founder of Farm Sanctuary, has had a hand in providing refuge, care and healing for thousands of farm animals, who otherwise would not have made it. Gene is a beacon of light whose purpose is centered on, not just providing sanctuary for these gorgeous animals, but also without judgment, getting people back in touch with their humanity and empathy, and aligning their actions with their values. That is a very beautiful thing. Today's conversation is uplifting and heartwarming, as much as it is educational and powerful. So open your hearts to one of the biggest hearts I know, Gene Baur, founder of Farm Sanctuary.
Rip Esselstyn:
All right, gang. Here I am with Gene Baur. I want to welcome Gene to the PLANTSTRONG podcast. You've never been on the PLANTSTRONG podcast.
Gene Baur:
I haven't.
Rip Esselstyn:
So it's great to see you. The last time that we were together virtually, was you were a participant, or rather I should say, a keynote speaker at last year's Plant-Stock event. And just hit a absolute home run. Before that, I know you've traveled through Austin a few times. And on your 25th anniversary tour of Farm Sanctuary, you came here, you came to one of our monthly potlucks in the old VW van.
Gene Baur:
Right. That was so fun. And you had this great crowd there. And we were able to talk about the issues. It was really wonderful to be hosted at this event that you did. And then also we did something together at Whole Foods, and we just... And there was also this thing we spoke on when we had to get back from overseas, which was quite an eventful return journey.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yeah, yeah. No, it's been great getting to know you. And then of course you've written several books, one of which, your most recent, Living the Farm Sanctuary Life. Your coauthor was Gene Stone, who obviously has helped me with some of my books. So we have that connection as well, which is really neat. So you are the co-founder and president of Farm Sanctuary. And you founded this 35 years ago, is that right?
Gene Baur:
That is correct. In 1986.
Rip Esselstyn:
1986. And tell me, Gene, so what inspired you to be the founder of Farm Sanctuary 35 years ago?
Gene Baur:
Well, at the time, we didn't really have any notion about how the organization would grow, and how there would be other Farm Sanctuaries around the world, like we see today. But back in 1986, it was really a simple instinct, that there are bad things happening to animals in the factory farming industry. We need to investigate this, document it, and expose it. So that's how we started. And during our investigations, we found living animals literally thrown on piles of dead animals, so we started rescuing them. And that's how the sanctuaries began. And during our investigations, one animal led to another animal, and then we realized we needed a farm.
Gene Baur:
Because back in those days, we were operating out of a donated row house in Wilmington, Delaware. So we didn't even have a farm. So our Adopt a Farm Animal program began very quickly, because we would rescue animals, rehabilitate them, and then find a home to place them. So many of the things that we do today, were inspired by what we were doing in the early days, rescuing animals and telling their stories, and then adopting them out and encouraging people to see them as friends, not food. But what we've also come to realize is that we need to change the system. We cannot rescue our way out of this problem of factory farming, we need to change the system. And we've done that as well over the years, but we're increasingly now focusing in that area.
Rip Esselstyn:
I want to go back even farther than that, because to me, it is amazing what you have launched with Farm Sanctuary. And now there's Farm Sanctuaries all over the world, that I think we're inspired by what you launched in 1986. And I'm just wondering, so growing up, were you super empathetic, and did you always love animals? And did you always have a certain sensitivity that helped guide you down this path?
Gene Baur:
Yeah. And I think I've always been pretty sensitive, right? And very much upset to see harm done to others. And I grew up in a very conservative Catholic family, so I had certain lessons hammered into me about helping the least of these, and being responsible. And sometimes those lessons can be a little harsh, sometimes they can be I think beautiful. But for me, it was just growing up seeing harm around me, and ultimately not wanting to participate in the harm that humans are causing to the planet. And one of my early memories as a kid, was when this beautiful oak tree across the street from my parents' house in the Hollywood Hills, was cut down.
Gene Baur:
And it just viscerally bothered me, this beautiful old tree that had been a presence for so long, since I was a baby, just cut down so that the neighbor's house could be made bigger. And it just bothered me. And also seeing wild animals hit by cars in the neighborhood, seeing the violence that humans do to other humans on television during wars and things like this. And I basically just didn't want to be a cog in a wheel of a system causing so much harm. So I started getting involved with environmental groups, with human rights organizations. I ultimately learned about factory farming and how it causes harm to people, to the earth and to animals.
Gene Baur:
So I went vegan in 1985. And in 1986, started investigating places to see firsthand what was happening. And that's how Farm Sanctuary ultimately started through our investigations and our rescues.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yeah. Yeah. How old were you when you started becoming an activist, like joining environmental groups and stuff like that? Are we talking in your teens or later?
Gene Baur:
A little bit in high school. So I guess that would be teens. And the first time I had an inkling that I was eating a dead animal, was when I was in high school. And I had come home and my mother had made a chicken dinner. So I saw this bird on the plate with the legs and wings attached on his or her back, and I was repulsed by the idea of eating this animal who had been a living creature. So that was my first inkling. And I didn't eat meat for a while after that, but that memory faded, and then I got back to regular habits. Everybody around me was eating meat, so I just fell back into it.
Gene Baur:
But then in 1985, I traveled around the country, so I was about 22, 23 years old at the time, and I started meeting activists. And to me, that's when the activism really kicked up. It was when I started getting out and aligning with and working with and volunteering with other activist organizations. Prior to that, I guess I would say I dabbled in it, but after '85 I was full steam ahead.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yeah. I can't even imagine how much you have learned about being a effective activist over the last, since you embarked on this over 35 years ago.
Gene Baur:
Oh, yeah. A lot of trial and error experiences. And so much of, I think being an effective advocate, is actually paying attention and recognizing the impacts of your actions. And sometimes passionate activists can be just so focused on a wrong that needs to be addressed, and they just hammer it full steam ahead, and sometimes turn people off. So one of Farm Sanctuary's organizational values, and it's something that I feel very strongly is effective, is to speak to people where they are on their own journeys. And ultimately to try to find common ground and to build from there. Back when I was a younger activist, for example, if somebody told me they stopped eating veal, and veal is young calves that are taken from their mothers at birth and chained in crates that are two feet wide for their whole life.
Gene Baur:
So a lot of awareness was raised about the veal industry. And some people said, "I don't eat veal anymore." Back in the day what I might've said is that, "Well, the veal industry comes from the dairy industry. So if you really care, you shouldn't drink cow's milk." That would have been a truthful statement, but it would have not likely engaged and inspired the person who has shared that they're trying to do better. And today what I would say is that, "It's great that you've stopped eating veal." And celebrate that positive step. And then also at some point bringing the dairy thing, but first celebrate, find that common ground, and then build from there. As opposed to right away saying, "Well, that's not good enough." Which turns people off.
Rip Esselstyn:
You mentioned that you fairly early on, just to educate yourself, you started investigating the horrific nature of what was going on at the farms, the stockyards, the slaughterhouses. That to me, requires... I mean, that to me is so indicative of how much passion you had, to try and write these wrongs. But what were some of the things that you saw? If you don't mind sharing. Because to me that's going in maybe undercover, or however you would do it, that to me requires such a level of commitment and courage, and just cojones.
Gene Baur:
Yeah. Well, back when I was doing this, I went to hundreds of places, and I would not get a job there. Investigators in recent years actually get a job, and they work in these places. So that's a little different where you're actually participating in some of these really horrible cruelties. But for me, I would go in, document the conditions, and get out, basically. And this would be at all hours of the day. And in some cases, I would be confronted by people who worked at these places. And those were challenging circumstances. For example, I investigated the Hallmark Slaughterhouse in Southern California in Chino, which in 2008 became the site of the largest ever beef recall in US history, because of the way they were mistreating downed cows.
Gene Baur:
I was there in the 1990s, and a lot of that work actually set the stage for what happened in 2008. But I was in there once with a rental car and a camera out the window, under a bunch of things so it wasn't visible, to document how downed cows were being dragged off of trucks, left in this unloading area. And then eventually they were being slaughtered. So as I was sitting there in the car, I all of a sudden noticed I was surrounded by five guys. And then one guy reaches in and grabs the keys out of my car. And they're saying, "What are you doing here?" And the first thing I said is, "Maybe you should call the police."
Gene Baur:
And they did, because I was in a pretty vulnerable position there. And the police came and ultimately basically told the guys to give me my keys back, and I drove away. But there've been other situations where I've ended up in a police car, when a veal farmer in Wisconsin called the cops. So there've been some pretty hairy circumstances. But I've felt that it was really important to see firsthand what was happening, to be able to document and speak with authority on the conditions. So that's why I started doing this. And I'm really glad that I did. And then later on, I actually went to Cornell University and got a master's degree in agricultural economics, which included courses in animal science.
Gene Baur:
So this was another form of investigation and undercover work, where I wasn't announcing that I was a vegan, but I was there listening to and observing the indoctrination that occurs with young pre-vet students, and other people who might care about animals. But once they enter into this system, their empathy is somewhat diminished. And some people who cannot go along with causing such harm, leave the programs. But those who go along with it, tend to be hardened and become less empathetic to other animals.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yeah. You've got a quote that I remember, and it goes that... Just the way the whole infrastructure and system is set up today, undermines our empathy, which is a part of our humanity. And I find that to be so absolutely beautiful. And somehow or another, we lose sight of our humanity, because we just become a part of the system. And we're not thinking for ourselves, we don't see what you and others see. And to me, what you're doing to be able to open people's eyes, to see the horror that is going on all around us, that we've just turned a blind eye to, it's a crying shame.
Gene Baur:
It is. It is. And I think most people are humane. And most people would rather not work in a slaughterhouse. And it's a system that is not aligned with our humanity, not aligned with our compassion. And I think sometimes people who work in this industry, may feel that they have no choice other than to do it. Sometimes as ways to validate their actions and to rationalize what they're doing, they might even treat animals more cruelly, to make the point that these animals don't matter. So sometimes you actually see sadistic behavior in these places, but you also have consumers who are unwittingly participating, and don't really look and don't want to know.
Gene Baur:
So many times when I've raised the issue of what happens to animals in the food system, people say, "Don't tell me, I don't want to know." And because it is upsetting. So we have to walk, I think, a very delicate balance between creating a situation where people will not put up a wall, but will instead be open to listening and learning and understanding. And that's the one thing that sanctuaries do I believe, is that we create this positive interaction with people and other animals. And when somebody sees an animal who's now been allowed to live, I think it's easier to hear where they came from. And then in that way, you can talk about the abusive system. And then you can talk about the possibilities for solutions.
Gene Baur:
I think another reason that people oftentimes don't want to hear, is because they don't know what they can do instead. So we're talking about how bad the system is. People are participating in it. They believe that they don't have a choice. And that's where the work you're doing is so important, in terms of showing people what you can do instead. And that I think is critically important. And with my second book, that was a big part of it, is the how to. So sometimes the how to can be even more important than the why to, in terms of just creating change.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yeah. And when we close out this podcast today, I want you to talk about some actionable steps that the people can take. But before we do that, you must be super excited because... Was today July 16th or something like that?
Gene Baur:
I think the 13th, but I'm not sure.
Rip Esselstyn:
Anyway, you guys opened up your doors again just a couple of days ago, right?
Gene Baur:
Yes, yes, yes, yes. After COVID, yes.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yeah, yeah. I mean, how fantastic does that feel to have people being able to go in and see the animals and experience what you've been building for 35 years?
Gene Baur:
It's so beautiful. I mean, it's a sanctuary, right? And who doesn't want to be in a sanctuary. And it stands in stark contrast to a slaughter house, which is where all the animals would have gone if they didn't come to the sanctuary. So it's beautiful to see, it's very exciting. People who work on the farm are very excited to welcome visitors. And the animals also are excited. Now, some more than others. And for the animals, they can choose if they want to come and hang out with people, or if they want to go further away in the pastor, they're free to do that as well.
Rip Esselstyn:
And are there some animals that are more excited to see humans like... I'll just throw out something, like donkeys. Are donkeys more excited to see humans or cows or ducks, or is it just dependent upon the individual?
Gene Baur:
It largely depends upon the individual, but there are some tendencies among the species. And also, these are social animals, so they start to learn that they're in a safe place. So some animals like sheep, for example, who might tend to be somewhat shy to people, get to know that at Farm Sanctuary, they get petted. So we have sheep that actually will paw at you like a cat or a dog, so you pet them. So it really depends on individuals, but there are some general tendencies. But also there's a social context. And at Farm Sanctuary, the animals know they're in a safe place. So generally speaking, they welcome visitors.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yeah. I would love for you to talk about some of the animals, and share a couple of the stories of the animals that are at Farm Sanctuary, but I want you to start with... So to me, part of your origin story was, you would go to the Grateful Dead concerts, and you'd sell vegan hot dogs, which I absolutely love. And at some point, you've found Hilda. And Hilda started at all. Can you let everybody know who Hilda is?
Gene Baur:
Yes, absolutely. So in the early days we had our Volkswagen van, the one I drove through Austin and met you with, and we used to use that van to do investigations of factory farms, stockyards and slaughterhouses. And we also used that van to sell vegan hot dogs at Grateful Dead shows. And that's how we funded Farm Sanctuary in the early days, it's also how we started doing education and discussing the reality of animal agriculture with the general public. But the way we found Hilda was that, we went to Lancaster Stockyards in Pennsylvania, and this is in 1986. At the time, it was the largest stockyard east of Chicago. It's a place where animals are brought and trucked from hundreds of miles away, to be sold at an auction. And then they're purchased either by other farmers, or in many cases by slaughterhouses.
Gene Baur:
But behind the sock yard was a dead pile, because animals die in transit. Oftentimes they're crowded very tightly. So in addition to going through the stockyard and observing conditions, we would always stop by the dead pile behind the stockyard. And on this one day in August of 1986, we saw dead cows, dead pigs, dead sheep, and maggots they were so thick you'd hear them buzzing. And off of this dead pile, a sheep lifted her head. So we were surprised by this, and thought she was probably in really bad shape the fact she was on this dead pile. So we called the veterinarian thinking she would have to be euthanized, and loaded her into the van, brought her to the veterinarian.
Gene Baur:
And as he started examining her, she started perking up, and then she stood up. She had just passed out I think, because of heat exhaustion. She was in a crowded truck, it was a hot summer day coming from upstate New York into Pennsylvania. And then probably what happened is the truck driver backed up to the stockyard, unloaded the sheep that walked off. And then there were some bodies in there of dead sheep, and Hilda who was unconscious. And he probably just drove around back, unloaded the bodies on the dead pile, and Hilda was one of them and she wasn't dead. And we came by the next day and we rescued her.
Gene Baur:
And she lived with us for more than 10 years at Farm Sanctuary. And we now have a Memorial stone where she's buried in the middle of the sanctuary. So Hilda was our first rescue. And in addition to rescuing her and rescuing the sanctuary work, she also helped us to launch this no downers campaign, because Hilda was a downed animal, an animal too sick to walk. And every year, animals too sick to walk were being dragged on to trucks, taken to slaughter, and used for human food. So we started campaigning and advocating for policies to prevent animals too sick to walk, from being transported and slaughtered for food. So that campaign is still with us today in fact.
Gene Baur:
And we were able to get a federal prohibition on slaughtering downed cows for human food, which is how Hallmark ultimately ended up getting in trouble in California. We are now petitioning to prevent downed pigs from being used for human food. So that campaign continues, but in addition to rescuing her and educating people, Hilda helped to start this whole no downers campaign, and the advocacy work we do.
Rip Esselstyn:
Wow. Speaking of campaigns and advocacy work, didn't you meet just yesterday with Corey Booker?
Gene Baur:
I didn't meet with him yesterday, but I've met with him from time to time. And just yesterday, Corey Booker introduced the Farm System Reform Act, to try to combat factory farming. And I posted an Instagram picture, but that was from a couple of years earlier.
Rip Esselstyn:
Got it. Got it. That is so fantastic. Yeah. So have you met Corey, obviously?
Gene Baur:
Yeah. I've met him a few times. Yeah. And it's amazing to have somebody that is so passionate, who's a vegan advocate. And he recently became a member of the senate agriculture committee. So I think he will be able to use that position to advocate for some policies, hopefully to combat factory farming and promote a healthier, more just, plant-based food system.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yeah. Bravo to Corey.
Gene Baur:
Bravo, man. But it's a heavy lift. I mean, this industry is so deeply entrenched. And factory farms get billions of dollars every year. But if we can start tilting a few million here and a few million there towards plant-based and local sustainable agriculture, that's I think how change happens, it's incremental. But yeah, so he introduced the Farm System Reform Act, and is a major champion in Washington DC.
Rip Esselstyn:
Well, you talk about on your website... Speaking of which, your website, of all of you listeners, you need to go visit farmsanctuary.org. It is fantastic. You guys have done a spectacular job with that website. But on there, you talk about how... Well, let me ask you, because I don't want to be the one to share it, but how many animals around the world annually are basically slaughtered for food?
Gene Baur:
It's something like 60 or 70 billion land animals. And when you start talking about fish, it's in the trillions. And unfortunately it's an extractive industry. It's bad for animals, it's also bad for the earth. In order to feed that many farm animals, we're destroying the planet. In the US alone, 10 times more land is used for animal agriculture, as opposed to plant-based agriculture. We're cutting down rainforests in order to grow soy to feed animals. So what we're doing is extremely destructive, it's inefficient. And it causes harm to all of us. There was a statistic I saw not long ago, that is shocking in terms of life on earth.
Gene Baur:
If you looked at all the mammals living on earth, 96% are either humans or farm animals. Only 4% of the mammals living on earth, live in the wild. And we're losing species, so we're losing biodiversity. And when we cut down rainforests and destroy ecosystems, that's one of the results. In the case of birds, 70% are domesticated, mostly chickens. And in fact, scientists tell us we're now living in the Anthropocene era, which is an era dominated by humanity. And a couple of the things we're going to see in the fossil record in millions of years, are plastic and chicken bones, because of the way we're living and the things we're producing.
Gene Baur:
So I'm hopeful that in addition to concerns about animal suffering, there will be increasing recognition of the ecological harm that this system causes, and also the harm to workers, to consumers and to our humanity, both biologically, but also I would say emotionally, and maybe even spiritually. When we cause so much harm to others and we start rationalizing it, we do lose our empathy. And again, that is I think a very important part of our humanity.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yup. Yup. Well, you also talk about how, and you mentioned this in spade, but how it hurts our planet. And specifically what I think nobody can deny in 2021, is to the extent that climate change is here, is real, and it is pretty nasty. And I just saw a statistic. This is probably about three weeks ago. You know Sailesh Rao from Stanford.
Gene Baur:
Climate Healers I think.
Rip Esselstyn:
Climate Healers. Yeah. Well, Stanford, and I can't remember who they partnered with, but they did a study to find out what percent of global greenhouse gas emissions are actually coming from animal agriculture. In the past we've heard numbers from the World Watch Institute and the World Bank, that it's anywhere between 15% to as high as 51%. This new study shows that between the life cycle and the supply chain and all these things, 82%.
Gene Baur:
Insane.
Rip Esselstyn:
Insane. So we cannot abolish animal agriculture fast enough.
Gene Baur:
Absolutely agree. Absolutely agree.
Rip Esselstyn:
Otherwise as a species, and you said we're entering, what is this called? The what?
Gene Baur:
The Anthropocene era.
Rip Esselstyn:
The Anthropocene era will not be much longer.
Gene Baur:
No. No, not for us. I mean, I think the earth will ultimately somehow continue on, but potentially in a very different form. But the harm we're causing to other animals, ultimately is causing harm to us. In the immediate term with heart attacks, but in the longer term in terms of species survival. And also it's just so much more beautiful to have forests on the planet, and diverse species of animals and plants that we live with. But we're destroying these. And then we're domesticating and mass producing billions of animals confined in factory farms, right? Who produce enormous amounts of waste, that is often destroying the health of citizens in neighborhoods, oftentimes people of color.
Gene Baur:
So there's also environmental racism connected to this. If you look at the workers, people who work in slaughterhouses, oftentimes people without many resources or many opportunities, they are also exploited in the system. So it's a massive system of oppression, and we need to create solutions. So I think we need to speak about the bad things, call them out, but then also change the system to enable people to live in ways that are healthier, I think more aligned with their own values. Because I think most people do not like the cruelty of factory farming or slaughterhouses.
Gene Baur:
And also eat food that nourishes us, instead of eating food that makes us sick. I mean, if you think about how we're feeding ourselves and living on the planet, it's completely irrational and harmful. So just really stepping back and trying to be able to have those kinds of conversations about living in a way that is aligned with our values, that we feel good about. And that's also aligned with our interests. And I think if we frame these in that way, it's pretty hard for people to disagree. There might be some rationalizations about, "Oh, we've done this forever." But that rationalization could apply to lots of really bad things.
Gene Baur:
So just because we've done something doesn't mean we need to keep doing it. And I think sometimes things have to get really bad before people wake up, and maybe we're there now, I hope.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yeah. I hope so too. So you told us about Hilda. I'd love to know about a few of the other animals and their stories. And you guys have a adopt an animal program at Farm Sanctuary as well. So who were some of the animals that our listeners could adopt, and what are some of their stories?
Gene Baur:
Well, I think a good way to do it is just go to the website, farmsanctuary.org, and there's information on animals people can adopt. And I visit the farm occasionally, but I actually wasn't there during a lot of COVID, and just got back recently. But I can tell you a couple of my personal experiences with some of the animals at the sanctuary. And one that I often remember is Opie, who was a calf who was born on a dairy farm. And he was sent to the stockyard on the day he was born to be sold, because he was a male born on a dairy. And male calves are not useful to dairy farms. And he was a newborn, he was very frail. He was still wet from afterbirth. And he fell in an alleyway, and he was just left there to die.
Gene Baur:
He was a crumpled heap on the ground. So I asked the stockyard worker what was going on with the calf, and he just matter-of-factly said, "Well, I've got to bury him later today." I said, "Well, what if I take them off your hands?" And he said, "Sure, go ahead." So I took the calf to a nearby veterinarian, and she started examining him. His temperature was so low it would not read on the thermometer. She said, "This calf, it makes no economic sense to care for this animal. Why are you wasting your time?" So I pushed back and said, "To me, this is not an economic unit. This is an individual, I want to do what I can to help him." So she finally gave him intravenous fluids, and I brought it back to the sanctuary and watched over him 24 hours a day.
Gene Baur:
And as time went, the light started coming into his eyes, because they had been sunken in and he was almost comatose. So they're starting to be a little sparkle in his eye, was able to lift his head. Then he was eventually able to stand, and able to take a bottle. I was feeling really good about the progress he was making, but he really wasn't thriving. He seemed a little bit depressed, and I was wondering what was missing. And then I thought, he needs to be with his people. He needs to be with the cows. So I brought him up to the cow barn and I put him in a pen there, and the other cows came and mooed and welcomed him. And he perked right up.
Gene Baur:
So it really showed me that these are social animals, and that they are impacted by and effected by their environment. And this was probably the first time that Opie was in an environment where cows were friendly, and felt safe, and were able to express themselves, and to socialize in healthy and positive ways. So that was one of those stories I love telling, because it speaks about just how they're disregarded in the industry, and how they're such social animals and are very much influenced by their social environment, similar to how people are influenced by our social environment.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yeah. Yeah. We had an interesting thing happen, we were just in Wisconsin on vacation. We were staying in a little 900 square foot little cabin next to this little lake. And the loons and the bald eagles, and just the myriad amount of birds, it was incredible. One morning we woke up and there was a little morning dove. A little, maybe I don't know how old it was, but it had a hurt wing and a hurt right leg. And my two daughters, Sophie and Hope, they took it and they got a shoe box. They made a nest in there and flowers, and they were giving it water. And they ground up seeds and looked on the internet to see what could they feed this little morning dove.
Rip Esselstyn:
And we had it for three days and it was trying to get better. It ended up dying one night when we were sleeping, but the amount of compassion and empathy and wanting this little morning dove to get better, was so riveting and so profound. And when it died, we just talked about the circle of life and how absolutely unfortunate it was. But they did everything they could.
Gene Baur:
It's such a beautiful thing, right? To see this empathy and care.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yeah. No, it was a beautiful thing. And then we had a service where we named the little morning dove Sunny, and we put Sunny on top of a bonfire and cremated him. And then we all went around in a circle and said some things about Sunny. And then we had a little burial, and we made a little grave stone and put Sunny. And then we didn't know when it was born, but put the death date of Sunny, and then a great bird. It just made me think, especially knowing I was going to interview you today. I mean, the amount of light that just came into our little world just over Sunny, just in three days, and seeing the girls hold Sunny and sleep... not sleep with Sunny, but basically take care of Sunny like you would not believe.
Rip Esselstyn:
It made me think, "Oh my gosh, the amount of joy and gratification that you and everybody at Farm Sanctuary must get." because you're doing such fabulous work, is just bountiful.
Gene Baur:
I couldn't agree more. It's bountiful, it's beautiful. It's inspiring, and it's a win-win right. Helping other animals, watching them heal is so nourishing to our souls, right? So it's a beautiful thing. And getting to know these other animals as friends, not food, that's a big part of Farm Sanctuaries message. And we live on this planet with many other people, many other animals, and to try to create relationships that are based on mutuality, as opposed to relationships based on extraction. And when it comes to farm animals, they are among the most abused creatures on the planet. And when somebody is abused by somebody with more power, that abused individual is oftentimes denigrated.
Gene Baur:
Abusers denigrate their victims. So that's the world we deal with in terms of how farm animals are regarded. And just as an example, being called a Turkey is not a compliment, right? Or being called a pig is not a compliment, right? So these are subtle ways that one person might criticize another person, while at the same time implying and perpetuating this criticism of farm animals, who have done nothing to deserve such a negative stereotype. And by the way on pigs, they're very clean animals. They will not go to the bathroom where they sleep. And one of the early animals we rescued, for example, was Charlie, who's a pig.
Gene Baur:
And he came from Lancaster Stockyards. He was too sick to walk, a downed animals, so we rescued him. We were rehabilitating him. And at the time we were living in a little row house in Wilmington, Delaware, with a little shed in the back attached to the kitchen. So at night he'd sleep in his shed. And I remember some nights he would bang on the kitchen door to come in. And the reason he did that, was because he did not want to go to the bathroom in his bedroom. So we'd open the door, he'd walk in, we put a bucket under him. He would pee in the bucket. And then he went back to his bed. So these animals, they have these inclinations to live in a way that is not harmful, sleeping in your own urine and feces is not healthy.
Gene Baur:
And in factory farms, they don't have a choice. They're confined in crates and they live on these slatted floors. And they're in these warehouses with the urine and feces smells that are horrible, but they would not choose that. And if given the agency and the opportunity, they would live in a clean, healthy environment.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yeah. Pigs are so phenomenal. Well, actually growing up, we had four different pet pigs over the span of maybe 10 years. And we loved every one of them.
Gene Baur:
A pig's eyes are a lot like a person's eyes. And I think Winston Churchill said something like, "A dog looks up to people, a cat looks down to people, but a pig will look you straight in the eye." And they do have a very human eye.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yeah, yeah. So let people know if they want to visit one of the Farm Sanctuaries, there's two of them, right? And where are they located?
Gene Baur:
That's right. We have one sanctuary in Watkins, Glen, New York. It's a beautiful part of the state. It's the finger lakes, so there's waterfalls, there's wineries. It's a gorgeous part of the state. We're next door to state forest. So Watkins Glen, New York, we have day visits. And we're going to also soon be opening up our overnight accommodations in Watkins, Glen. Then we have another sanctuary-
Rip Esselstyn:
Oh, wait. Can I stop you for a sec? Can I stop you for a sec?
Gene Baur:
Yeah.
Rip Esselstyn:
So overnight accommodations, I was on your website, I saw these little tiny houses. They are so charming.
Gene Baur:
Oh, they're beautiful. I was just up there. Before the tour season opened, I was able to spend a week or two up there. And there's a porch. So you wake up, you sit on the porch and see the pigs coming out of their pasture. The tiny houses are amazing. We also have bed and breakfast cabins, and it's a wonderful place to stay.
Rip Esselstyn:
So how many people can it accommodate any one night?
Gene Baur:
Yeah. Well, each tiny house has a bedroom, and then a little front area where there's a couch, so maybe four people per tiny house. And there's three of those. And then we also have three bed and breakfast cabins, that are more rustic. The bathroom's in the barn right next to them. And those each have two beds, so those can maybe also accommodate four people each.
Rip Esselstyn:
Right. And if I want to go, can you just show up or you have to get a ticket? Is there a waiting list? How does work?
Gene Baur:
Now we're doing it with an online signup. So for people who want to visit our farm in upstate New York or in Acton, which is near Los Angeles, can go to our website farmsanctuary.org. And we're doing tickets, I guess, where people sign up and they register. That way we can, especially as we're ramping back up after COVID, we can keep track of the numbers and make sure that it's safe for all the people, and also all the animals. So people have to sign up online to visit. I think you can do this just on your phone, even on the way, assuming there are slots available. But going to the website's the best way to do that.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yeah. And how many animals are there in Watkins Glen, and in the one in Acton?
Gene Baur:
Between our two farms we have about 800 animals, and about 700 of those are in Watkins Glen, about 100 in the Acton. The Acton farm is much smaller geographically, but it's closer to Los Angeles. So they have different types of experiences. The one in Watkins, Glen is more of an immersion experience, where you take this journey to the country. The one in Acton oftentimes it could just be like a day trip. So both of them though are open now, thankfully, after COVID. And we're going to be planning more events and more activities. Every year as Thanksgiving approaches, we have an event that's the celebration for the turkeys, where they're our friends, they're our guests of honor, not the main course.
Gene Baur:
So we do this every year, have been doing it since 1986. So we will do that this fall, both in Watkins, Glen and in Acton, California.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yeah. One of the fun facts that I discovered in looking at the website, is that the Watkins, Glen's location is right near the underground railroad. Right? Which, how appropriate is that, right? I mean, where you were liberating people from exploitation, and here you're doing the same thing with animals.
Gene Baur:
Yeah. Western New York has been called the burned over district. It was an area with a lot of change and challenging of systems. Frederick Douglas, for example, spent a lot of time up in Rochester, New York. The first women's rights convention was in the 1840s and Seneca Falls, New York. Harriet Tubman retired up in Auburn, New York. So this was going up through New York, following the gourd or the big dipper, pointing north up into Canada during the pre Civil War days. And it's a beautiful part. And also people like Brigham Young did a lot of preaching around there before going west.
Gene Baur:
So there's all kinds of things that people were talking about and thinking about at the time. And I think now it could become a little vegan Mecca, I'm hoping. And recently learned of some new vegan businesses in the area. So it's a really beautiful part of the world. And hopefully a lot of people come visit.
Rip Esselstyn:
Can you believe what you started 35 years ago?
Gene Baur:
Well, it's wonderful to see the sort of energy and enthusiasm for living compassionately, right? I mean, I feel very positive about the role I've played, but there's so many others that have played such an important role over the years. Right? And we've had amazing volunteers come through. In fact, Hilda, our first rescued animal, was named after Hilda, our first intern. And I don't know where she is now. So when we first started, it was really small, and there was not much awareness of how it would grow. But we've been very fortunate to have such generous supporters, and also volunteers over the last 35 years. And I can only see that continuing.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yeah. Well, it makes so much sense. It's such a touchstone for activism, for people to, I think get in touch, as you've said throughout this podcast, with what are their true values. And you go there and you see it, and I think you can't help but be transformed and changed.
Gene Baur:
Yes. I think, again, it's really aligning our actions with our values. And most people are humane. And it feels so much better when you start doing that and living that way. But people need to have tools. How do you do it? And this is where nice vegan foods and access to those, it's critically important as well.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yeah. And another thing that I heard in watching a bunch of these great videos that you have on the website, is how the animals become ambassadors for other animals, right? Can you explain what that means exactly?
Gene Baur:
Yes. Well, at Farm Sanctuary and at all sanctuaries, we're going to only be able to rescue a very small number of those who really deserve to be rescued. So the animals that come to sanctuaries become ambassadors for the billions who are not able to help. And when people get to know individuals at Farm Sanctuary, they get to recognize that they're not that different than their cat or dog, that pigs love belly rubs, that sheep love to be petted. And that these are social animals that have memories. They have dreams. I mean, when they're sleeping, you can see them twitching because they're dreaming. So they're not that different than cats or dogs or ourselves. And when we cause harm to them, it's something that many people are doing unwittingly, but it's something that I think hurts our own humanity.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yeah. You know who's got a real, real soft spot in their heart for all this is Joaquin Phoenix.
Gene Baur:
Oh yeah.
Rip Esselstyn:
Who you obviously have a very special relationship with. And he just did a video recently on Earth Day, called Indigo and Liberty. What was that about?
Gene Baur:
Oh, that was such an amazing experience. So I don't know if you saw Joaquin Phoenix's Oscar acceptance speech when he won best actor for Joker?
Rip Esselstyn:
Absolutely.
Gene Baur:
Amazing. And he closed that speech quoting his late brother, River, saying, "Run to the rescue with love and peace will follow." The next morning, I get a call that there's a cow and a calf at a slaughterhouse, and the slaughterhouse owner's ready to let him go. And this was with Shaun Monson from Earthlings and Amy with LA Animal Slave, and Joaquin. So after watching this speech Sunday night, Monday morning we're all at the slaughterhouse talking about rescuing these individuals from slaughter. And paperwork had to go through, so they didn't ultimately come to Farm Sanctuary until Tuesday, but it was just a magical thing that occurred.
Gene Baur:
And Joaquin and Rooney are solid animal people, advocates for vegan living, and played a role in making that happen. And I just feel very fortunate that the timing worked the way it did, and that they're such amazing advocates, like Joaquin out there.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yeah. Well, congrats on that.
Gene Baur:
It's amazing.
Rip Esselstyn:
No, I think it's fair to say that we are on the precipice of a new food economy that's based on plants and not animals. And as we said earlier, we have to get there as fast as humanly possible, because the consequences are not pretty. So speaking of which, Gene, as we close out, what are some action steps that people can do if they want to join the movement?
Gene Baur:
I think the first thing is just to sign up for Farm Sanctuaries newsletter at our farmsanctuary.org website. Take action. We have action steps there, like there might be legislation introduced that it would be helpful to write to members of Congress on. So there's policy efforts.
Rip Esselstyn:
Is that effective if you actually write? I mean, is that worth everybody doing that?
Gene Baur:
Absolutely. Democracy is a participatory sport, so it's important to show up. Now, I'm not going to say that writing is going to immediately lead to a law being passed, but it really starts building a case that people care about this, and politicians do pay attention. So I think we need to be involved in that arena. And at the same time, we can each make a difference with our personal choices every day, by choosing to eat plant foods and supporting vegan businesses, instead of supporting the factory farming industry. So I think change happens through personal change, but also through systemic change.
Gene Baur:
And that's where getting involved in the legislative process... And there might also be opportunities to do things in a person's own neighborhood, for example getting a local restaurant to sell vegan foods. We've done this for years at Farm Sanctuary. In fact, in the 1990s, shortly after we got the farm in Watkins Glen, we went to all the local restaurants asking them to sell vegan food for our visitors. And one of the restaurants that did this was Burger King in the early nineties. First time a veggie burger, the BK Veggie, and it went nationwide in the nineties.
Gene Baur:
And then more recently now we have the impossible Whopper. So talking to local restaurants, local businesses, and encouraging them to adopt more humane practices, and sell more humane products like plant-based foods, for example. So you can do things locally, but also it's important to be involved with policy at a larger level, I think.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yeah. And have you partnered with other sanctuaries?
Gene Baur:
Oh yeah. We have a whole network of sanctuaries that adopt animals from us, we adopt animals from them, we work together at placing animals. Again, at Farm Sanctuary we have this network, but there might be a sanctuary near where people live. So visiting those sanctuaries and getting involved in their programming is another way to be active locally. And I think so much change happens really at the local level, at the grassroots level. So getting to know activists in your communities, and then that way if you go to a local restaurant and ask them to have a vegan item, and then you partner with the local sanctuary or other allies in the community, you just start building a movement. So a lot of really good things happen at the local level.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yeah. Have you helped Tracey and Jon Stewart with the Hockhockson Farm Sanctuary?
Gene Baur:
Yeah. So it's amazing how the Stewarts ended up getting involved with us. Back a few years ago now, the Stewards were in a vacation rental house, and somebody had left a copy of my first book in that rental. Tracy picked the book up, read it, got a hold of us, and then started their own sanctuary. So we worked with them as that was getting underway, and they're now doing their own thing. But I'm very sympathetic and supportive of what they're doing. And they're also, in addition to caring for animals, growing food. And that I think is really the next phase for Farm Sanctuaries.
Gene Baur:
We can't rescue all the animals. So in addition to rescuing some, who become ambassadors, I think it's important for us also to demonstrate solutions through plant-based agriculture. We have to show that there are ways out of this current problem. And I think be positive examples for solutions. So I think they're doing that at Hockhockson.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yeah. It's interesting, when I was looking on your website and I was looking at these just adorable, tiny little houses that you could spend the night in, I noticed that there's three books it looks like that are in each one of these. And obviously there's the Farm Sanctuary, there's living the Farm Sanctuary Life, and Do Unto Animals by Tracy Stewart. So that was beautiful.
Gene Baur:
That's right. That's right. In fact, Tracy helped to design the tiny houses. And there are these beautiful wallpaper in them, with foxes and mushrooms. It's got a really amazing nature's motif, and Tracy designed those.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yeah. Yeah, yeah. She's got good taste.
Gene Baur:
Yes, she does. Absolutely.
Rip Esselstyn:
So everybody that's listening. One of the things I want you to do is go to farmsanctuary.org, check out the website. And if there's one thing that I want you to do, I want you to watch the power of sanctuary, it's a six minute 28 second video, that is amazing. It really is spectacular. You guys did a great job with that.
Gene Baur:
Thank you. Yes. And share that with friends too. That's the other thing. Another thing people could do is sharing social media. But thank you for that. I think that's an amazing video, and it really encapsulates what we're trying to do at the sanctuary.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yup, yup, yup. So if you want to donate to Farm Sanctuary, if you want to adopt a Farm Sanctuary animal, look into all these things. It's great. Before we close, let me just ask you this. So I saw on your Instagram that you've been foraging for mushrooms, any luck recently?
Gene Baur:
Yes. We found some chanterelles recently. This has been a fairly thin year compared to last year, where we found morels, we found all kinds of mushrooms. But we found some chanterelles, and a chicken of the woods recently. So a little bit of luck. Yes.
Rip Esselstyn:
Wow. And where were you looking for these mushrooms?
Gene Baur:
Well, I live here in Northern Virginia in Arlington, so there are a number of parks that are forested, and usually just walk around the local parks and sometimes have some good luck.
Rip Esselstyn:
Wow. Wow. I actually once went foraging for chanterelles in Portland, Oregon, and found a bunch. And little did I know that they're 20 bucks a pound.
Gene Baur:
Mushrooms are amazing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I love mushrooms. And there's a whole life cycle of mushrooms. The mycelium under the earth, they help trees talk. And there's the plant kingdom, there's the animal kingdom, and then the fungi kingdom, which has more species than ever. So it's a real interesting area of interest right now for me.
Rip Esselstyn:
It is. It is. Great wormhole to go down.
Gene Baur:
Oh yeah.
Rip Esselstyn:
Gene, you are a beautiful man with a big heart. Thank you so much for all the work that you're doing to make this planet a better, more compassionate place.
Gene Baur:
Thank you. I feel the same way about you, man. And we're doing our part, right? Every bit helps. And I really am grateful for this opportunity to speak with you, and hopefully we get a chance to see each other again soon.
Rip Esselstyn:
Absolutely. All right. Will you close it out with me? Ready? Peace. Turn it around, engine two. Keep it PLANTSTRONG. Thanks to people like Gene Baur and organizations like Farm Sanctuary, we are moving the needle from cruelty to compassion, and from indifference to integrity. Yes, being PLANTSTRONG means eating the best and healthiest foods on the planet, but it can also mean being strong in your values, and becoming a voice for the voiceless. To learn more, visit farmsanctuary.org, or visit the show notes on the episode page at plantstrongpodcast.com. Thanks so much for listening.
Rip Esselstyn:
Thank you for listening to the PLANTSTRONG podcast. You can support the show by taking a quick minute to follow us wherever you listen to your favorite podcasts. Leaving us a positive review and sharing the show with your network is another great way to help us reach as many people as possible, with the exciting news about plants. Thank you in advance for your support, it means everything. Have you had your own Galileo moment that you'd like to share? What happened when you stepped into the arena and shed the beliefs that you thought to be true? I'd love to hear about it. Visit plantstrongpodcast.com to submit your story, and to learn more about today's guests and sponsors. The PLANTSTRONG podcast cast team includes, Carrie Barrett, Laurie Kortowich, which Ami Mackey, Patrick Gavin and Wade Clark. This season is dedicated to all of those courageous true seekers, who weren't afraid to look through the lens with clear vision, and hold firm to a higher truth. Most notably, my parents, Dr. Caldwell B Esselstyn Jr. and Ann Crile Esselstyn. Thanks for listening.
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