#113: Sonya Looney - The Power of Picking Yourself
We all have our proverbial mountains to climb, but today’s guest has climbed some of the highest mountains — on her mountain bike.
Plant-powered pro mountain biker, Sonya Looney, is Rip's guest and, in addition to crushing it as a professional mountain biker, Sonya has also become well-known as a health andd mindset coach, setting clients up for success no matter what they're trying to accomplish.
Rip and Sonya share many commonalities - from being professional athletes, to becoming health coaching entrepreneurs, and raising plant-powered kids. In fact, they spend most of their time today talking about chasing these big dreams, taking risks, remaining resilient, and not quitting even in the face of inevitable setbacks and frustrations.
That's why we've called this episode, "The Power of Picking Yourself."
Whether you're trying to change your diet, develop new habits, or change careers, have the courage to believe that you are worth it and, like Rip and Sonya, you'll be well on your way to winning at the game of life.
Episode Resources
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About Sonya Looney
Mindset, plant-based nutrition, and sport- three things that have powered Professional Mountain Biker Sonya Looney to the top of her sport. With over 15 stage races wins across the globe and a 24-hour World Champion title to her name, Sonya is no stranger to thriving in challenging and long events. She takes her research and learnings off the bike to her top ranked podcast- The Sonya Looney Show, helps others with nutrition backed by her Cornell Plant-Based Nutrition certification. She is a Health Coach through Vanderbilt University's Integrative Medicine Program and has her Master's Degree in Electrical Engineering. Sonya's goal is to help people be better every day and to show people they can find their potential through doing hard things. She believes that curiosity and optimism are the keys to always learning and growing. Sonya has an online course- The Moxy & Grit Mindset Academy that is a mental toughness and positive psychology course for athletes. She has several business projects on the go including her Moxy & Grit apparel line and her Plant-Powered Academy online community.
Full Transcript
Sonya Looney:
Quitting is a muscle. If you start quitting then it becomes easier to quit and then you lose trust in yourself. And that's not just in sports, that's in lots of different things. When you're trying to make a new habit or you're trying to do something different in your life, set a goal that's really easy to achieve, that way you can ... and have loftier goals as well, but you need to start burning in that pathway so that you can strengthen that muscle and build that trust in yourself. And that's why I don't quit races and that's why, I mean, I pretty much don't quit anything because that's part of my identity is I'm somebody that doesn't quit, I'm somebody that is okay with being vulnerable in situations where I might come up short publicly. And I don't like it when that happens, but knowing that I am still okay inside if that happens has been really a cleansing thing after being a perfectionist and always being so worried about what other people thought about me.
Rip Esselstyn:
I'm Rip Esselstyn, and welcome to the PLANTSTRONG podcast. The mission of PLANTSTRONG is to further the advancement of all things within the plant based movement. We advocate for the scientifically proven benefits of plant based living and envision a world that universally understands, promotes and prescribes plants as a solution to empowering your health, enhancing your performance, restoring the environment and becoming better guardians to the animals we share this planet with. We welcome you wherever you are on your PLANTSTRONG journey and I hope that you enjoy the show.
Rip Esselstyn:
Hello, PLANTSTRONG gang. I hope you're having a plantastic day. My name is Rip Esselstyn and I am the host of the PLANTSTRONG podcast. I think it's fair to say that we all have our proverbial mountains that we have to climb, but today's guest has literally climbed some of the highest mountains on her bicycle. Plant powered pro mountain biker, Sonya Looney, is my special guest today and I am really amazed at how much the two of us have in common from our athletic backgrounds, raising plant strong children, motivating and coaching others as to all the benefits of the plant strong lifestyle, there is definitely quite a bit of overlap.
Rip Esselstyn:
Well, in addition to crushing it as a professional mountain biker, Sonya has also become well known as a mindset coach, and that's where we're going to really hone in and focus most of the conversation today, helping you set your mind up for success no matter what it is that you're trying to accomplish. Now, of course, both Sonya and I are here to help you on your plant based journey, but we're also here to remind you that this journey that you're on and the work that you're doing to improve your health, actually is the reward, all the struggles, all the setbacks, everything that is being put up in front of you. I hope you're intrigued, and if you are, let's set the path forward to success with Sonya Looney.
Rip Esselstyn:
All right, everybody, welcome to another episode of the PLANTSTRONG podcast. Today, I've got Sonya Looney. And Sonya and I go back ... When did you ask me to be on your podcast? Do you remember?
Sonya Looney:
I think it's been close to four years ago.
Rip Esselstyn:
Probably four years ago, so maybe 2016 or 2017. But what I love about you and the direction that you're going in your life is that you are winning at the game of life. And the reason why you're winning at the game of life is because you're overcoming fears, you're redefining success, you are trying new things, and these are all things that as you say, this is where the magic happens, right? And so I think so many of us in life are reticent to change what we're doing, life beats us down and we don't always have the ability to dust ourselves off and pick ourselves up. And so I can't wait to talk about what redefining success and overcoming fears looks like from your perspective. But before I dive into you, I want to just let the audience know that you and I have a lot of things in common. So we both have been former professional athletes. I'm assuming you're still not a professional athlete, I could be wrong.
Sonya Looney:
Actually I'm still a professional athlete, believe it or not.
Rip Esselstyn:
Fantastic. Fantastic. We both love mountain biking. I never did mountain biking full time but I did the XTERRA Triathlons and you're obviously world champion mountain biker. We're both plant based athletes and very much fiercely so. We're both raising plant strong kids, plant strong children, and very proud of it. We're both podcast hosts and healthy eating advocates. I think it's fair to say we're both living life out of our comfort zones as entrepreneurs and athletes and it's, I think, one of the things that has made life so vibrant for both of us. We both have taken, I think, very big risks and we're betting on ourselves. We're helping in coaching others to do the same, I'm doing it by getting them to eat this way.
Rip Esselstyn:
And in looking at your website, I'm so enthralled with all the programs that you have going on with mindset mastery, and Moxy and Grit mindset classes, I want to take them. And we obviously both were featured in the Plant Based Athlete that just came out about two months ago by Robert Cheeke and Matt Frazier, who we've both had on our podcasts. Let's take a step back here before we dive into some really great conversation, and I want to ask you just first, give me a little background on Sonya, and where you grew up, and what that was like.
Sonya Looney:
Yes. I grew up in Albuquerque, New Mexico. And I was the kid that was the nerd, and I still am a nerd, just that I own it. I was a kid that was in band, and I was first chair in the band, and I was friends with my teachers and I really wanted their approval, and I worked super hard in school because I really valued education and hard work from a young age. And that was taught to me by my parents, so always do my best and to work hard. But that wasn't always easy, I always wanted to feel included by the other kids and I wanted to be so badly one of the popular kids but I wasn't because I wasn't secure and confident in who I was. So I kept just trying to do what everybody else was doing and try to fit in, and it just never worked for me.
Sonya Looney:
And it wasn't until the end of high school when I found endurance sports, and running was the first sport that I came across, that I found confidence in myself. And then I started making choices not for anybody else but for myself, and that kept opening new doors, one after the other, and led me to where I am today.
Rip Esselstyn:
And so, were you any good at running? Did you have a affinity for it?
Sonya Looney:
I wouldn't say I was good at it, I didn't really know how to train properly. I ran a marathon when I was 18 and 19 but I just really had no idea what I was doing. I guess I was decent at 10K because the UNM cross country team asked me to walk onto their team, but I had just found mountain biking and I decided that I was going to be a mountain bike racer and I just never went to the cross country team at UNM.
Rip Esselstyn:
So you found mountain biking when you were how old?
Sonya Looney:
I was one month away from turning 20, so 19.
Rip Esselstyn:
Okay. Right. And what was it about mountain biking that you liked?
Sonya Looney:
I liked the freedom part of it. I wasn't a cyclist growing up and I think this is really important for people to hear is that there's a lot of doors that can open in your life, there's a lot of things that you just never even knew were available to you, and it's so important to be open to new opportunities and following your curiosity because if I had never tried mountain biking, my life would be drastically different. And it wasn't something anyone in my family did, and just some guys from my work invited me to go riding, I had been to a few spin classes at the gym because I kept injuring myself as a runner because I would overtrain, and that's how I found mountain biking and it opened up this world to me that it's just changed my life.
Rip Esselstyn:
Where did you go to college?
Sonya Looney:
I did my undergrad at UNM in New Mexico and then I really wanted to move to Colorado the year I became a professional racer and I decided that going to grad school at CU Boulder would be a really great option to go become a professional mountain biker. So I was in the PhD program for electrical engineering and it was weird because there's people sleeping in the lab and they are fully committed to that program and I felt a slacker because I was committed to doing well in school, but I also just had this dream of being a pro mountain biker.
Rip Esselstyn:
And so you got your undergraduate degree, it was an engineering or neuroscience? What was it?
Sonya Looney:
Told you I'm a nerd.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yes. Okay. So you go to Boulder, you're getting your Master's degree in engineering and you're also starting to mountain bike at a higher level, do you then go get a normal job and are you also still mountain biking? What did that look like?
Sonya Looney:
Yes, so I had only been a professional, racing at the elite level, for a couple of years, it was something I was doing while I was in grad school, and I thought to myself, one of the reasons I went to grad school is so I could become a professional racer and have the flexibility to train, which sounds crazy, but I just didn't want to follow this 9:00 to 5:00 and not be able to chase my dream. And flexibility was so important to me and control of my time from the very beginning. So I actually ended up working for a startup in Boulder, and it was a solar engineering company which was this was such a great way for me to start connecting with some of my deeper values about the environment, and I got to design solar electric and solar wind systems for homes and commercial buildings around Boulder, and I got to choose my hours, which enabled me to train and have my blogs, this is back in 2008, and just do different things, and keep exploring what my interests were, and also just to have diversity of experience in my life.
Rip Esselstyn:
Mm-hmm (affirmative). So what year was it when you actually turned pro? And what does that mean exactly? What did that look like?
Sonya Looney:
Yes, this is such a great question because this can vary across sports. So I became a carded professional athlete, I think it was in 2006. And what that means is you have to race at the national level, there's categories, it's called something different now but it was called beginner, sport, expert and professional at that time. And you have to get a certain amount of points and results at these national level events to upgrade and the governing body of cycling will give you that upgrade, I think triathlon might be the same, to become a carded professional. But being a carded professional doesn't mean that you just get paid to ride your bike, the sponsorship world and the money part of endurance sports, because that's the world I know, is really challenging and there's a lot of people who are racing at the top level even that have to work a full time job on the side to pay the bills.
Rip Esselstyn:
yes. So that first year that you were a pro, were you able to make any money?
Sonya Looney:
No. Actually I wasn't very good. I'd love to have one of these amazing stories where it's like, I became a pro and then I was winning immediately, but I think it's really important to say that, that didn't happen. And it takes years of hard work to start chipping away at getting better at something, and that's what gives it meaning. So for me, I was coming in second to last place at my races. At that time in my life I was definitely a perfectionist and I really struggled with when things weren't going well. And up until that year of my life, I was always a high performer and everything just worked out for me.
Sonya Looney:
So that year I would actually cry in the middle of my bike races, I'd wish that I could just poke a hole in my tire because I was so ashamed of my results and I was so focused on the outcome and what people would think about me and what that meant about me. And it wasn't until I started going to yoga and I had these great instructors in Boulder that it was so much more, it was it wasn't just about movement, it was about figuring out who I am and being okay with who I am, and then that set me on a different trajectory, especially as I got into endurance sports when you have a lot of time to think about things.
Rip Esselstyn:
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Rip Esselstyn:
Well, I hear you loud and clear there, it's amazing how you put so much of your heart and soul into training and then on game day, just for whatever reason, you're having an off day, you don't feel well. And I've been on the bike too saying, you know what, I wish I would just get a flat, and then that way all this will be over. Of course, I never had such luck. Actually, once I did get a flat and I wasn't able to finish, and then I regretted it because it was the only time in my career I never finished a race. And that to me is something that was always important to me to always finish. And I know that's one of your things is to never really quit, right, always finish.
Sonya Looney:
Quitting is a muscle. If you start quitting then it becomes easier to quit and then you lose trust in yourself. And that's not just in sports, that's in lots of different things. When you're trying to make a new habit or you're trying to do something different in your life, set a goal that's really easy to achieve, that way you can ... and have loftier goals as well, but you need to start burning in that pathway so that you can strengthen that muscle and build that trust in yourself. And that's why I don't quit races and that's why, I mean, I pretty much don't quit anything because that's part of my identity is I'm somebody that doesn't quit, I'm somebody that is okay with being vulnerable in situations where I might come up short publicly. And I don't it when that happens, but knowing that I am still okay inside if that happens has been really a cleansing thing after being a perfectionist and always being so worried about what other people thought about me.
Rip Esselstyn:
Mm-hmm (affirmative). So would you say that today you're no longer a perfectionist?
Sonya Looney:
I actually would say that. And I like that question because it made me think about it a little bit. But I think about the actions that I take, and it doesn't mean that I do sloppy work, but you could work forever at something and never get to an outcome that you want. And something that John Joseph said on a podcast ... You know John Joseph?
Rip Esselstyn:
Yes.
Sonya Looney:
Something he said, I think it came from Hinduism, but it was something like, "You're only entitled to the work, you're not entitled to the outcome. The work is the most important part." So I came up with this mantra for myself and it's, the work is the reward. So I'm always focused on that, doing the best work I can. And the best that you do one day might be different than your best another day. And as athletes, we certainly know that, that's the case. And even when we're going through different seasons of our lives or coming out of this pandemic, life can be hard sometimes, and what you're doing today might not be the same as what you did a year ago or a week ago, but just showing up and committing to being your best is just so powerful.
Rip Esselstyn:
Mm-hmm (affirmative). No, I love the work is the reward, and it really is. At the end of the day it's about the journey and the work and not so much the destination that gives us, I think, the greatest amount of ... fills us up with gratitude and self worth as athletes, right, that we're doing ... I did the triathlons for over a decade, it is all about, what is your self talk? What do you say to yourself day, after day, after day so you can remain resilient and positive? Because as you said earlier, I mean, we got to show up every day, right?
Sonya Looney:
Yes.
Rip Esselstyn:
But so, what are some of the tools that you would tell one of your students when it comes to self talk? Because I know so many of us if we have, I'm just going to make something up, 20,000 thoughts over the course of the day, I bet your average person, of those 20,000 thoughts, I bet you 80% of them are negative.
Sonya Looney:
Yes. Yes. And this is such a huge category of research and one that I really love. But the first step of having better self talk is being aware of your self talk. A lot of times you're not even aware that you're saying these negative things to yourself. And you can do that with journaling, with a meditation practice, you don't have to sit on your cushion and meditate, but just try and be aware of the thoughts that are coming into your head and the context of those thoughts, and then maybe even have a script for yourself of a way to reframe what those things are. And I think that the hardest part that I've been seeing is that in the positive psychology movement it's about reframing, it's about telling yourself a story in a different way, and the words that we use are so powerful because that's how we see the world. But there's also an acceptance piece of things happening and then not just trying to shrug them off but also accepting that they're there and not pretending that the emotions are there. So I think there's a lot of nuance there.
Sonya Looney:
But something that people can start using immediately, and I think I mentioned this in the Plant Based Athlete book, but there is a great psychologist and researcher, Martin Seligman, and he coined the term, explanatory style. And that is looking at how you're telling yourself a story and then choosing to tell that story in a different way. So the really easy example that I frequently use is about the weather, because everybody is affected by the weather that likes doing things outside. And I've seen this myself at races around the world, people melt down whenever the weather goes bad. And I'm happy when the weather goes bad because it doesn't mean that I like it, but it means that I know that I'm going to be able to still thrive in that situation. So you could look outside and be like, oh, my gosh, it's raining, I'm going to get cold, this is going to suck, I didn't come for bad weather, I came to the southern hemisphere for sun, or I'm not very good in these conditions.
Sonya Looney:
And you just start telling yourself all of these stories, and you start listening to them, and you start making all these excuses. And by the time you get to that start line, you've already lost, you've already set yourself up to just be miserable on the day. Or you could say, well, I don't really love it when it's like this, but hey, I'm going to go out and have an adventure today, today, I'm going to get really fun pictures because it's super muddy, I'm never going to forget this day, and the next time it's rainy or challenging I'm going to be better because of it. And it's a practice and it also matters what you do in training. So working on your mindset has to happen on a daily basis, not just on race day. So if it's bad weather outside, are you going to train or are you going to skip your ride? So being able to reframe it in a way and then really believe what you're telling yourself, the credibility part is important too.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yes, no, I really liked that reframing. I had a good friend that used to say, and this is, it's a popular quote but, "There's no such thing as bad weather, just bad clothes", right?
Sonya Looney:
Yes.
Rip Esselstyn:
So if you're wearing the right clothes, every day can be a great day to get out there and get some training in. Did you have an event or an epiphany that led you to realizing just how important mindset is?
Sonya Looney:
Yes. I mean, those early races in my professional career where I would just be beating myself up constantly ... And let me tell you, as a health coach, I have my own clients and a lot of people beat themselves up, it's a really common thing. Learning how to not beat myself up as much, it's impossible to stop completely, is a lesson that I've learned. And endurance racing has really been a way that I've healed that negative pattern. And the race that really started taking that to the next level was this race I did in Nepal, and this was the one that I did a TEDx talk about. And this is the highest mountain bike race in the world and I did it in 2012 and 2013, which seems so long ago now. But I just had never done anything like that before, and no woman had ever finished, then I thought, I really want to have an adventure and I just want to see what happens if I go to this event.
Sonya Looney:
And it was incredibly difficult, it was so uncomfortable, I don't know if anybody's ever used a squat toilet at 15,000 feet and your legs are tired, that's tough. So it wasn't just on the bike, it's when you finished the course for the day, and it was a 10 day race, you don't get that rest because it's cold and it's uncomfortable. And just being in that situation was such an eye opener for me because it helped me get out of myself. I started noticing the villages that we were staying in, in Nepal, that was really incredible to see how people were living and that it wasn't just about bike racing, and noticing the people around me and how they were faring or not faring well. And whenever a challenge is presenting themselves, how am I going to rise to the occasion? And how am I going to choose to move forward?
Sonya Looney:
And in my TED Talk, it's funny because almost nobody's seen me cry ever in real life, not even my parents as a grown up, and I was crying in this race because I got to 18,000 feet with my bike and my brakes had failed, and I was winning the race, and it was day nine out of 10, and there's no way to get those fixed because there's no bike shops in the middle of the Himalaya. So I was crying-
Rip Esselstyn:
You didn't have disc brakes?
Sonya Looney:
I had disc brakes but they don't test product for riding at 18,000 feet because, why would anybody do that?
Rip Esselstyn:
Sure. Sure.
Sonya Looney:
So I promised myself that I was going to document my experience because this was such a unique experience. So I took a video of myself crying and I was just carrying on about how I'm screwed and XYZ. And then that became a really powerful thing for me to use later, and I put that in my TED Talk to show, hey, it's hard whenever you're doing different things that you've never done before and it's okay to feel this way, but you can also still come back. And in that race I was able to borrow somebody's brakes that had dropped out and finish the race. But you can still come back the next year. And it's what you learn in that moment about yourself, regardless of what the finish was and how you choose to proceed, that's what makes you who you are.
Sonya Looney:
And that's why I love these really crazy stage races, multi-day races around the world in countries that maybe we wouldn't just go visit as tourists because it is raw and you just can't experience those things in your daily life, and it's such a strong feeling when you're out there and the highs are high and the lows are low. And then when you get back to your daily life you realize, hey, I can deal with a lot of different things and maybe I can even help other people deal with a lot of different things that can feel really hard.
Rip Esselstyn:
Mm-hmm (affirmative). Well, so let's go back to 2012 for a second, do you still have your engineering job or have you left that? Are you a full time pro mountain biker?
Sonya Looney:
I still have my engineering job at this time, yes.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yes. And so, did you tell your workers, hey, you know what guys, I'm going to go do this mountain biking race in Nepal, it's 10 days, I'm going to go up to 17,769 feet. Would they just think you're crazy?
Sonya Looney:
Pretty much everybody thinks I'm crazy but that's my last name is Looney, so I got to live up to it.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yes, Looney Tunes, right. But so you went, you did it, you ended up finishing. I saw the TED Talk, It's spectacular. I highly recommend everybody go check it out. And then you decided you wanted to go back the next year?
Sonya Looney:
Yes, I wanted to do it again. And it was amazing how much easier it was, because when you're doing something for the first time, no matter who you are, no matter what it is, it's always hard, you're always uncomfortable because you don't know what's going to happen and you don't know what to expect, and it's a lot easier the second time around. And I only have one kid but I'm guessing if you have two kids it's a lot easier the second time around, right?
Rip Esselstyn:
Yes, and then three is when it really gets easy. And I thought it was really apropos the way in how this really translates into life where you're trying to get to the very, very top of this pass and you're like, oh, I think I'm there, and there were 14 false peaks, 14 where you're like, that's not it, that's not it, got to keep going.
Sonya Looney:
Yes, there's so many false summits in life and there really is no real summit. And I know that might sound cliche, but as somebody that works hard towards lots of different goals, once you achieve a goal, they're just going to be more like it. And we all think that, well, if I could just be X then I would be happy. And we keep putting our happiness onto the horizon when we achieve something. And really, like we talked about earlier, the work is the reward. And loving what you do and who you're surrounding yourself with on a daily basis is the win, it's not the peak that you get to because there's just going to be a ton more it. And also you might get to the peak and feel empty, and that's how I felt when I became world champion. I thought, well now what am I supposed to do? Now what am I supposed to chase? And it was a really weird feeling. And I know that lots of other people have felt that way too.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yes. What year was that, that you became a world champion? And what event was it?
Sonya Looney:
It was in 2015 and it was in 24 Hour Mountain Biking. So it's you race your bike for 24 hours straight on a course and it's like, I guess, Formula One but it's on a mountain bike, and you have a pit and you can stop in your pit. And the idea is that you stop as little as possible and stay healthy, because some people go blind in 24 hour racing, it's actually a really common thing, and they get their vision back but it's crazy.
Rip Esselstyn:
Holy Toledo. I mean, I've done a 24 hour mountain bike race before but it was with a relay, right. And there were some people did it solo but I was with a relay and I was like, god, these solo people, I don't know how they're doing it, I don't know how they're doing it. Did you sleep at all or did you just keep going for 24?
Sonya Looney:
I think I stopped for seven minutes total just to change batteries or get food. My husband was awesome, he was my support crew, so he had to stay up the whole time as well and make sure that I kept going.
Rip Esselstyn:
Wow. Do you have any ambitions to do more 24 hours or do you feel like you're done with that?
Sonya Looney:
No, I don't actually enjoy 24 hour racing if I'm being totally honest.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yes.
Sonya Looney:
I'm somebody that really values sleep and I also really adventure and seeing different things, so riding around in circles isn't my favorite thing. So that's why I primarily focus on stage races which are multi-day races like a mountain bike Tour de France or a single 100 mile race on one day.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yes. Well I love how you said, after doing that Yak attack in Nepal, you then went and you raced in Haiti, which is in the Caribbean, that looks such a beautiful venue, you went to Mongolia, and you did a stage race in Mongolia I'm assuming, and then I don't know if you did a race or you just went and visited the Sahara Desert.
Sonya Looney:
Yes, it was a race in the Sahara desert and Atlas Mountains. Yes. There's been some crazy things that I've done whenever people bring them up, but it's just the more you do, the more you realize you can do. And curiosity is something that's really important to me, and following that curiosity of, well, I wonder what happens if I go here and try this. And I love going places where I'm not really sure what's going to happen or what it's going to be like, and that's off the beaten path. Because, like I mentioned, you just really get to know yourself in a way that you wouldn't in a more comfortable situation.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yes. So when did you decide and what was the impetus to retire from engineering, from that job, and basically strike out on your own? Because that must have been a very, very hard decision.
Sonya Looney:
It was a scary decision for sure. It wasn't all at once. So back in, I mentioned, 2008 I had a blog and I would be writing about different products and adventures just because I loved sharing adventures with people, and this company I had written about their backpack, this company had reached out to me and invited me to be on their team. They owned a racing team and at the time it was called Topeka, Oregon, actually, I think it's still called Topeka, Oregon. And then the company, Oregon, they ended up asking me to be their national sales and marketing manager, which is a complete pivot from engineering.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yes.
Sonya Looney:
It just came so naturally to me and it gave me the opportunity to travel, to race my bike more, and I also created my own community events because I just really wanted to mentor and help people just have more fun on the bike or even just try new things in their life. So that job was awesome because it enabled me to do things that I wouldn't have been able to do in engineering, and also do more racing.
Sonya Looney:
And that team I was on, I didn't really get much support, I still had to pay my own race entry fees, I didn't own the equipment that I was riding, and I started getting offers from other brands, they wanted to work with me, but I couldn't work with them because it was a conflict with the team I was on. But the team I was on was tied up in my job, so if I quit that team, I'd have to quit my job.
Rip Esselstyn:
Mm-hmm (affirmative).
Sonya Looney:
So it was a big thing. So I had to come up with my own value proposition. And my husband was really encouraging in this and I think it's so important to have somebody, it could be your spouse, it could be a friend, but just somebody that really believes in you and helps you move forward. But I just started writing all my own proposals to sponsors. And it was weird because it's like, how much money do you ask for? How do you even know what to ask for or what to offer? And I just started and I waited my way through, and I was able to become a full time professional managing myself as an athlete, working with brands that I wanted to work on or work with.
Sonya Looney:
And it sounds amazing but it's really tough, because when you're negotiating your proposal, you're basically saying, hey, this is me, and if the brand says no, then you feel the brand doesn't like you, you're the one that got rejected. So you have to be able to separate yourself a little bit from that. And there's been so much learning that's happened. I think it was in 2013 or 2014 that I did that and I've been doing that ever since. And the lessons that I've learned from that and also just growing all these other parts of my business have been just ... I'm so glad that I did it, but again, it doesn't mean that it's been easy.
Rip Esselstyn:
No. No. And as you said, I think it's really important that you have somebody that's got your back and believes in you. And it sounds like your husband also was giving you the support and maybe even the push that you needed to do that.
Sonya Looney:
Yes, he told me, "Have the courage to believe that you're worth it." And I wrote that down in huge letters back in 2014, whatever year that was. And I still remind myself of that, have the courage to believe that you're worth it, because when you're asking for things, it takes courage to ask for things, and it takes courage to believe that you deserve something and without being entitled, but it takes courage to believe that and it's something that I am always working on.
Rip Esselstyn:
Mm-hmm (affirmative). You wrote a blog about the power of picking yourself, can you talk a little bit about that?
Sonya Looney:
Yes, so first of all, this was inspired by a podcast that Matt Frazier did, and it was about becoming a New York Times bestseller, when he became a New York Times bestseller and what that meant to him, so I encourage people checking out that episode in No Meat Athlete radio. But for myself I thought, hey, that's what I've been doing year after year. And a lot of times we wait for somebody to pick us to say that we're good enough to do something. And if you look at all the things that I've done in my life, nobody told me that I could do that, I just decided that I was going to do it because that was the right thing for me.
Sonya Looney:
So the first time I picked myself was when I decided I was going to run a marathon and I did it. I wasn't looking for external validation, I just did it because this is what I wanted to do. And same with becoming a professional mountain biker, no one in my family supported that, I got a lot of flack for wanting that, for walking away from my engineering degree, a lot of flack. And I just had to keep picking myself. And same with starting a podcast, I love when people start podcasts now because you have to pick yourself and believe that you're worth it. And if you don't do that, then you're not going to be living your own life, you're going to be living for somebody else's ideal.
Sonya Looney:
And it takes courage to do that, because again, you could come up short, but you'll never know what you could do in your life. So everybody listening, if there's something in the back of your mind where you're like, I just really want to try that but I have imposter syndrome, I don't know if I can, just start and know that everybody that's starting something new doesn't know what they're doing and they figure it out as they go along, and just expect that to be part of the journey instead of to be immediately good at something.
Rip Esselstyn:
So this whole mindset stuff, it is such a deep well, a deep hole that really, I think, we all need coaching and we need to delve into at a more deeper level, and I think most of us just don't take the time to really understand it. And I think with some really simple teachings and principles, that it could take us a long way in everything in life. And what I love is that, I think you like me, we've taken a lot of learnings from our athletic careers and we've applied that into everything that we do, believe in yourself, positive self talk, show up, sometimes you don't feel it but just show up and you'd be amazed what happens when you have the courage to just show up.
Rip Esselstyn:
I was talking to, on my podcast the other day, Darren Arleen and he said, kind of what you said, but that's when the magic happens when you just have the courage to show up. And for him it was getting on an airplane, going into some crazy rain forest somewhere and finding the next super food that's out there. But he had to show up and get on that airplane and just like, all right, let's see if we can make this happen today.
Sonya Looney:
Yes, you got to keep chipping away. I've heard a couple good analogies, one of them is an ice cube melting, how long does that ice cube have to be sitting at room temperature before it changes state? And how long you have to keep waiting for it to keep heating up in the room? Or when you're chipping away literally at a rock, you'd be 1,000 blows and the rock hasn't broken and it could be on the 1,050th blow that the rock finally goes. So if you stop showing up it could be that next time you show up that you have a breakthrough, but if you don't do that you're never going to give yourself a chance.
Rip Esselstyn:
So true. So because this is the PLANTSTRONG podcast and we haven't talked about it yet, tell me about your journey to plants. How did that happen?
Sonya Looney:
I actually give all the credit to my husband. A lot of people when they meet us they think that Matt, his name is Matt, they think that I changed Matt's diet into plant based, but he's the one that introduced me to it. And I met him at BC Bike Race in Vancouver in 2012, which was a big year of my life obviously talking about some of the things from my past, and I met him. And stage races you end up eating dinner and being around people for a week straight, and I noticed that he kept eating these huge plates of food that was just beans, and vegetables, and just stuff that I would never think to eat at a race or just in general. And I asked him, "What are you doing?" And he says, "I'm a vegan." I watched Forks Over Knives, I learned that there's a lot of really powerful things with lifestyle diseases that you can do, and I just had never heard of that before. My experience was a negative experience with a few vegan individuals which was such a shame because there's a lot of beautiful, amazing people out there.
Sonya Looney:
So yes, I got really curious about it and I watched Forks Over Knives in 2012 and I thought, wow, I'm really afraid of getting cancer and heart disease is something that is prominent in my family. And I have family members that are super fit looking but they have high blood pressure. And I had heard of all these people dropping dead having a Heart attack at age 40 but they were fit and all that just scared me because I felt like it was just gambling and you had no control over your long term health.
Sonya Looney:
So once I realized, wow, this is really eye opening and I was angry that I didn't hear about it before. So I decided to change my diet because of that and it wasn't because I thought it would make me a better athlete, and that just came as a happy side effect. And I changed my diet gradually over time, my husband is more of a all or none, so he just threw everything out and the next day it was plant based. Whereas for me it took a couple of months, kind of like you recommend in your books is start small, start with breakfast, and then start with phasing out dairy and just that way. And also that helped me with my athletic performance because I was afraid, what would happen if I changed my diet? Am I going to get slower? Am I not going to get enough nutrients? Because there just wasn't a ton of information out there about it back then.
Sonya Looney:
And then something weird happened, I ended up winning way more races. And instead of trying to get that last spot on the podium, it just was I'd roll in and sure I'd have to fight for it, but I would start winning more races, and I'd recover faster, and I felt better in my life, and then I had more mental clarity to make these big decisions. So it's just been the best thing that I've ever done for myself. And being able to be an example for other people to show that you can do this in your life and that it'll do amazing things for you. And just to see everybody else's positive transformation and to hear all these different stories is just incredible. And what it does for the environment and for the animals, and it just makes sense.
Rip Esselstyn:
Well, yay Matt for introducing it to you. Does Matt work?
Sonya Looney:
Yes, so Matt is a financial planner and he's also the CEO of a business that he's built, it's a financial planning business, but he reinvented this business model of what it means to be a financial planner. But Matt also is a mountain biker. So he's traveled with me to a lot of these races, and in fact, Mongolia was his first international stage race, which that race didn't really go so well from an organizational standpoint for anybody.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yes.
Sonya Looney:
Yes, he just went and he did awesome, and yes, it's really great to be able to share mountain biking, and travel, and racing as just a part of our relationship.
Rip Esselstyn:
It's huge. Who's stronger on the bike?
Sonya Looney:
That would be me.
Rip Esselstyn:
That's wonderful, way to go. And obviously Matt can handle it, that goes to show you what a what kind of a man he is.
Sonya Looney:
Yes, Matt's super supportive. And yes, I'm so lucky to have him as my husband and my partner in crime and to be parents with Matt. I just miss having adventures together, that's been the hardest part about becoming a parent and not having a ton of support is that we just don't get to do those adventures as of lately.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yes. Yes, I hear you there. So when you're doing these stage races, how are you feeling yourself on the bike?
Sonya Looney:
The bike is pretty simple. Everybody has to do what works for them, but I'm primarily fueled by carbohydrates on and off the bike, but I use gels, and sports drink mix, and things like that just for fast digestion. And then off the bike, it depends on where I am but I have all these hacks for plant based travel because some of these countries I go to, they don't really have plant based options, so you have to bring your own. So I travel with a small rice cooker that has a steam basket built in. So I can almost always find vegetables, beans and grains, so I end up, if there's power, I just cook my own food at the race. A lot of races these days now are offering plant based options which makes things a lot easier, but yes, there's been lots of places where I've brought that rice cooker to cook my own food.
Rip Esselstyn:
Rice cooker that has a steam basket in it, what's the brand?
Sonya Looney:
I don't know. If you just go to Target or wherever you'll just see, they're smaller, they're about this big.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yes.
Sonya Looney:
I even use that now if I'm traveling somewhere. We went to this back country lodge for this event recently and I didn't know if they were going to have good plant based options or not, so I just packed my own food and brought the rice cooker. And in fact, that's how I cook for my son there because I wasn't going to feed him some of the richer foods. So I was able to make lentils, and split peas, and quinoa and things like that. Of course he decided he didn't want to eat that stuff after I went to all the trouble. But yes, it's just a good little hack for travel.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yes. Yes. I know that John Mackey, the CEO of Whole Foods travels with his own little rice cooker as well. Your son, how old is he?
Sonya Looney:
He is 16 months.
Rip Esselstyn:
Wow. Wow, he's young.
Sonya Looney:
He's a little guy.
Rip Esselstyn:
Right. So is he plant based?
Sonya Looney:
He is. He's been plant based since he was in the womb, he's never had any animal products. And yes, he loves eating, and it's really fun to get to share all the different foods that we eat. And he's a baby with garlic breath, which is really funny.
Rip Esselstyn:
Are you breastfeeding him?
Sonya Looney:
I did until about a month ago when he weaned himself.
Rip Esselstyn:
Got it. Got it.
Sonya Looney:
Yes.
Rip Esselstyn:
Well, wonderful. Was that just a wonderful experience?
Sonya Looney:
Yes, I'm really glad that I got to do it because with a pandemic I didn't have to travel for racing, so that made it a lot easier. And yes, I mean, I think breastfeeding is a difficult topic because some people have difficulty producing the milk to breastfeed, some people can't pump milk, so when they go back to work they can't really continue to keep their supply up. Some people just don't want to. But I think if you want to breastfeed it's a really great relationship with your child and it's really fun. And also just from a health perspective, there are so many benefits of breastfeeding your child, so I'm just really grateful that I got to do that for as long as I did.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yes. What's your son's name?
Sonya Looney:
His name is Bradley, and he's named after my dad.
Rip Esselstyn:
Bradley, nice. Speaking of your dad, what do your parents think of your journey in life to where you are right now?
Sonya Looney:
Well, I think they're proud of me but it's probably really hard for them all along because everybody as a parent you just want the best for your kids, and what you know is what you think is the best. So I did things really differently than they would have hoped. Fortunately, everything's worked out for me, so I think that they're proud and happy and I'm safe and all those things. Yes, every time I had one of these pivots they would say, "I don't know if you should do that, or this might be a bad idea", or even when I changed my diet that was super weird for them.
Sonya Looney:
But the cool thing is that I'm finally starting to bring them along with me. So now my mom makes tofu in an air fryer, which in the past there's no way she would even have tried tofu. So just seeing your family, and not everybody does that, but seeing people make small positive changes, and same with Matt's family, finally after how many years people are just starting to make these changes because it's become more mainstream and acceptable to be plant based instead of back almost a decade ago where these people thought we were weirdos.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yes. No, it's truly amazing how far plant based has come in the last 20-30 years. Yes.
Sonya Looney:
And your influence has been so amazing in my life and just in tons of people's lives, just the impact that you've had out there and I'm just so grateful for the work that you're doing and for the work that your father has done, and just having examples like you is just so important and so empowering and inspiring.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yes. Well thank you. We need a lot of people that are out there inspiring people and teaching people how to do this because I think you and I would both agree that the world's going to be a much better place when we can get as many people as possible being plant based. Tell me about what does a typical day for you look like when it comes to eating? Are you an oatmeal girl in the morning? What do you do?
Sonya Looney:
Yes, so breakfast is typically either oatmeal or pancakes, and I have my own cookbook, a digital cookbook I came out with a couple years ago, so both those recipes are in there. But the oatmeal is, I think this actually might have come from you, it's just steel-cut oats with hemp hearts, and fruits, and nuts, and maple syrup, and just stuff that I like, and flat ground flax, and a lot of people love that oatmeal. And before I thought oatmeal was the packet, the Quaker oatmeal packet, which is just basically a packet of sugar.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yes.
Sonya Looney:
So I love the oatmeal. And then my husband is the pancake guy and Bradley now loves being involved in everything happening in the kitchen, so he wants to watch and we got him this thing where he can stand and watch everything happening. So yes, oatmeal or pancakes. And the pancakes are made with whole grains, sprouted whole wheat flour, and there's nuts and seeds and all kinds of good stuff in there.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yes, what about lunch?
Sonya Looney:
So it varies because right now my training is in the middle of the day. So typically what I'll have next is probably around 10 o'clock and I'll have two pieces of sprouted whole grain bread with almond butter and some fruit, and then I'll go do my training. And then when I come back I'll eat a bowl of something, a whole grain bean, or a lagoon, or a tofu, vegetables and a sauce I like or maybe some avocado, a burrito, I actually eating pasta, I have really nice pasta dishes with good things in them. And then I'll-
Rip Esselstyn:
Have you wandered into any of the alternative pastas like red lentil, or black bean, or brown rice?
Sonya Looney:
Yes.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yes.
Sonya Looney:
I usually go for a brown rice pasta and I do like the bean pastas as well, those are really nice.
Rip Esselstyn:
Mm-hmm (affirmative). Okay. And then dinner more of the same?
Sonya Looney:
Yes. I mean, dinner I really to be focused on having beans and greens in my diet, and those are the two things that are really easy to let go if you don't pay attention to that. So yes, we try and make something every week maybe lentil dull or some chickpea something or other, just trying to involve beans and greens as much as possible because that ... Yes, so in dinner time we try to include those especially.
Rip Esselstyn:
Mm-hmm (affirmative). Do you have any goto desserts?
Sonya Looney:
Well I chocolate, so easy plant based chocolate bars, dark chocolate, it's delicious. Oh She Glows has some really delicious desserts that don't have tons of processed flours in them, so there's this flourless peanut butter chocolate chip cookie, and brownies, and things like that. So yes, I like sweets, for sure.
Rip Esselstyn:
Mm-hmm (affirmative). Do you have a favorite energy bar that you take on the bike with you?
Sonya Looney:
Yes, I actually like, I think the brand is Nature's Bakery Fig Bars.
Rip Esselstyn:
Mm-hmm (affirmative).
Sonya Looney:
Yes, those are good.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yes. Yes.
Sonya Looney:
I like Kind bars but sometimes the nuts, I need something a little bit more carbohydrate-ish, if that's a word, the nuts don't digest fast enough for the ride.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yes. Yes, I used to eat a fair amount of bars when I was doing the triathlons full time. God, there's so many out there right now it's nutty.
Sonya Looney:
Literally, pun intended.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yes, there's a brand called, Off The Farm, I think that you can only get them online, they are insane. They are so good. Just to give you an example, they have a cherry chocolate one and each one of these bars has 13 cherries in it.
Sonya Looney:
Wow.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yes. Yes. They got a mango in something and they've got a blueberry. But they're just so packed with real food and real fruit, it's cool.
Sonya Looney:
Yes, speaking my language. Off The Farm.
Rip Esselstyn:
Off The Farm. Yes, we'll have to put this in the show notes for people. So tell me, what makes you happy and content these days? Well, I'll start to answer the question for you, but it just sounds so idealic from where I'm sitting, a, you say a 16 month old or 18 month old?
Sonya Looney:
16.
Rip Esselstyn:
16 month old, you and your husband are, it sounds like, in this great stage, you've both got your own businesses. I know it's hard, but as you like to say, right, the work is the reward. But anyway, what is it that you're most excited about right now?
Sonya Looney:
Honestly this might sound really funny, but my parents coming to visit, because my parents still live in the States and with the pandemic it's made it really difficult for them to come up, because I live in Canada now and we recently moved to Squamish, British Columbia and it's made it really tough to see them. So they've only seen our son once and there's quarantine and all this stuff. So I'm just really looking forward to them coming next month, not only because I'm excited to see them, but I also am excited to have some adventures with Matt and some support and to spend a little bit more time working on and in my business, because there is no such thing as balance, I say that there's intentional imbalance. So it's like choosing what you want to be spending your time on for certain periods of time and really doing it well.
Sonya Looney:
So I'd say what makes me happy is having that variety, being able to get out on my bike and ride with cool people and have ... Squamish is the best place to mountain bike in the world and I'll just be blunt and say it because that's why we moved here. There's so much challenge on the technical terrain and it's so beautiful, so just being part of that community. And then it's such a gift to be able to do what I'm passionate about for my work, getting to be a health coach and do my podcast and get to talk to people like you. And yes, life is good and I'm really grateful for what I have.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yes. So would you say right now that you've successfully redefined what it means to be successful and you're right in the bullseye?
Sonya Looney:
I'd say that I'm right in the bullseye but I still have imposter syndrome just like everybody else and I still always wish for more. So there's definitely a balance or just a pendulum of being okay and happy, accepting where you are but still wanting to work for more and not letting that work for more take away from where you are today or from where your happiness is today.
Rip Esselstyn:
Mm-hmm (affirmative). You have so many gems, Sonya, I may have to listen to this several times and write down all of your great quotes here. You've got another quote that I love and it's, the most powerful voice is the one inside your own head, and is that something that you just came up with one day?
Sonya Looney:
Yes, it was when I was doing the mindset Academy. So I have, you mentioned my courses, the Moxy and Grit mindset Academy, and I put it out last year and it was hard to put that out because I had a baby and I could only, speak in a chip in a way, I could only work on it in really small increments over a period of time. And I just wanted to put all the things that I love talking about to help you live a happier, more resilient life in that course. And so that came out of that course. And we're with ourselves our entire life, and there's a lot of different ways you can interpret the word self, but it's important to be your own best friend. And the things that you tell yourself about life, and about yourself, and about what's happening around you so much impact how you view the world, how you view yourself, and most importantly, what you do. So that's why I really am passionate about mindset and self awareness because it really impacts your life experience.
Rip Esselstyn:
Mm-hmm (affirmative). Do you think that we, most of us, take ourselves too seriously?
Sonya Looney:
Yes, I do. Being able to laugh at yourself and I think be comfortable with yourself to not take yourself as seriously, and to be able to be a dork sometimes and laugh at yourself.
Rip Esselstyn:
I agree. I agree. Well, another quote, I'm going to throw it out there, when the going gets tough it's your mind that gets you to the finish line. And that really, really applies in life. One of my favorite quotes, it's a quote by Winston Churchill, long time ago obviously, and it's five Nevers, it's never, never, never, never, never give up. And I am constantly amazed in my life especially at seeing people who I think, by our definition, who become successful in whatever it is, you just got to be willing to persevere through the grind. And it is a grind, and you got to figure out a way to make the grind fun and enjoyable.
Sonya Looney:
Absolutely, it is, I think, the word passion, it's like suffering ... I can't remember the exact definition, the book, The passion Paradox by Brad Stulberg and Steve Magness goes into all this about following different types of passion. But yes, passion is suffering, it's enduring suffering, and just who's going to endure the suffering the most and have the best perspective of that, because it's not easy. Some days are amazing but it is not easy to do something day in and day out. And some days you want to quit and some days you do need a break.
Sonya Looney:
Burnout is something that is rampant and the hustle culture is rampant, and you do need to work hard, but if you find that there's something that you're passionate about that suddenly you just feel apathetic about it and you don't care anymore, and you're like, what is this? This isn't me. That probably means that you need to take a break. And I've wrestled with burnout, and now that I know to look for that, that's how I know to take a break. But it's uncomfortable to rest, it takes courage to rest and to take the time away when you could be working, but you need that empty space to recharge and to come back better.
Rip Esselstyn:
Couldn't agree with you more, that is so important. And I'll just give our listeners an example what I do because I pretty much swim year round and it's so easy to get burned out on swimming, and I've been doing this master swim program now for probably close to 25 years. And so what we do to mix it up is I'll throw on fins, I'll throw on a pole bow, you do the kicks, that's with a kickboard, we go to the lake now twice a week just to give your brain a break and do open water swims. It's the same thing with mountain biking, I mean, you probably know those trails in your area now like the back of your hand but it sounds like they don't get old, but you do things to mix it up and make it exciting and give your mind a bit of a break, and that can apply to everything in life.
Sonya Looney:
Yes. Well the cool thing about "technical sports", swimming is incredibly technical, you don't want to see me swim, but there's always something to work on, you could work on being faster, being more fluid. But you could work on, I don't know the technical terms for swimming, but the shape of your hand or always improving your stroke, or with cycling, road order, cornering, you're always going to be able to work on cornering, or braking, or body position, or speed. So there's just always something to work on. But again, making sure that you take a break when you need it is something that's really important too.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yes. Yes. Tell us a little bit about your podcast, when did you start that and what's it about?
Sonya Looney:
My podcast is called The Sonya Looney Show and I started it about four and a half years ago. And it's about mindset, plant-based nutrition and inspiring stories. And the whole point of it is to help people be better every day by learning from others. Just podcasting has been such a gift because it used to be people would say, your blog is really inspiring, or then it was your Facebook, your Instagram, and now these long form relationships you get to form with people through podcasting, because people are listening for an hour, that's a lot of attention, and getting to deliver it to them is just amazing.
Sonya Looney:
And then also getting to talk to all these guests. I met you because you agreed to come on my podcast, and just the amount of learning, learning is something that I'm really passionate about, and I have to be on top of my game when I'm doing an interview. So I read way more books, I spend a lot more time learning about other people. That's why I think everybody should at least start a podcast because the personal growth ... I mean, it's hard, right. It's again, the chipping away, the consistency, all those things, but you just learn so much and you meet so many great people.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yes. Well, Sonya, I really want to thank you for being on the PLANTSTRONG podcast, I want to thank you for what you're doing and how you've redefined your life and what success means, and for being courageous enough to really create a life that it sounds super exciting every single day. And as I started the podcast, in my opinion, you are winning at the game of life, and keep it up.
Sonya Looney:
Thanks, Rip. And thanks for having me on, I'm a longtime listener of this show so it's such an honor to be on the show and to get to spend some time with you.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yes. Hooray. All right, peace.
Sonya Looney:
Peace.
Rip Esselstyn:
Engine two.
Sonya Looney:
Engine two.
Rip Esselstyn:
Give me a fist. Keep it PLANTSTRONG.
Sonya Looney:
All right.
Rip Esselstyn:
Yes. Man, there were so many wonderful nuggets of wisdom in there that relate to sport, work, and life. Thank you Sonya for sharing your stories and teaching us the power of picking yourself up. What a valuable lesson. For more information on Sonya's courses and PLANTSTRONG resources, simply visit the episode page at plantstrongpodcast.com. Have a wonderful week and we'll see you next time.
Rip Esselstyn:
The PLANTSTRONG Podcast team includes Carrie Barrett, Laurie Kortowich, Ami Mackey, Patrick Gavin, and Wade Clark. This season is dedicated to all of those courageous true seekers who weren't afraid to look through the lens with clear vision and hold firm to a higher truth, most notably, my parents, Dr. Caldwell B. Esselstyn Jr. and Ann Crile Esselstyn. Thanks for listening.
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